The Religious Side

Brainstorm ideas of possible additions to the game. Read this before posting!

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Elvish_Pillager
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The Religious Side

Post by Elvish_Pillager » May 31st, 2004, 6:35 pm

I think Wesnoth needs some religion.

I'm developing ideas for a 'Religious Side'. The units I have so far are:

Monks
Martial artist style monks, not non-combat ones. They advance to Elite monks with skirmish and marksman, Nature monks with ambush and slowing attacks, and Mad monks with regeneration and berserk.

Acolytes
A downgrade of White Mages.

Pilgrims
Scout units, which upgrade to Missionaries and then Paladins.

Martyrs
These wimpy units turn into powerful Spirits when they die.
It's all fun and games until someone loses a lawsuit. Oh, and by the way, sending me private messages won't work. :/ If you must contact me, there's an e-mail address listed on the website in my profile.

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Post by Elvish_Pillager » May 31st, 2004, 6:54 pm

The martyrs need to be fixed. Right now they're more like suicidal power-hungry necromancers. They should only give benefits if they died on the enemy's turn, and not powerful units. Maybe money?
It's all fun and games until someone loses a lawsuit. Oh, and by the way, sending me private messages won't work. :/ If you must contact me, there's an e-mail address listed on the website in my profile.

AT
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WEll

Post by AT » May 31st, 2004, 6:59 pm

I hate to be blunt, but i dont really like these ideas. They don't really seem to fit, at all.

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Post by Darth Fool » May 31st, 2004, 6:59 pm

Martyrs should be wimpy units that die like any other unit, only they cost less to recruit.

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Post by Elvish_Pillager » May 31st, 2004, 7:02 pm

Darth Fool wrote:Martyrs should be wimpy units that die like any other unit, only they cost less to recruit.
"Charge, my hordes of martyrs" doesn't sound quite right.
It's all fun and games until someone loses a lawsuit. Oh, and by the way, sending me private messages won't work. :/ If you must contact me, there's an e-mail address listed on the website in my profile.

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Re: WEll

Post by turin » May 31st, 2004, 7:31 pm

AT wrote:I hate to be blunt, but i dont really like these ideas. They don't really seem to fit, at all.
I agree. White Mages are probably as close as we should get to religion in wesnoth.

I have always disliked fantasy games that make up their own religion, including gods, practices of worship, etc. Also, it probably offends many people.
For I am Turin Turambar - Master of Doom, by doom mastered. On permanent Wesbreak. Will not respond to private messages. Sorry!
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Post by Elvish_Pillager » May 31st, 2004, 7:38 pm

I don't see why people would be offended. There are plenty of made up gods in real life, after all. At least in those games they admit they're fake.
It's all fun and games until someone loses a lawsuit. Oh, and by the way, sending me private messages won't work. :/ If you must contact me, there's an e-mail address listed on the website in my profile.

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Post by turin » May 31st, 2004, 7:42 pm

Elvish Pillager wrote:I don't see why people would be offended. There are plenty of made up gods in real life, after all. At least in those games they admit they're fake.
It can be offensive that religion is something it is OK to joke about, to make up your own religion.
It can be offensive that religion is not taken seriously and a made up god is just as 'real' as your god.

Get it?
For I am Turin Turambar - Master of Doom, by doom mastered. On permanent Wesbreak. Will not respond to private messages. Sorry!
And I hate stupid people.
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Post by Elvish_Pillager » May 31st, 2004, 7:51 pm

turin wrote:
Elvish Pillager wrote:I don't see why people would be offended. There are plenty of made up gods in real life, after all. At least in those games they admit they're fake.
It can be offensive that religion is something it is OK to joke about, to make up your own religion.
It can be offensive that religion is not taken seriously and a made up god is just as 'real' as your god.

Get it?
These religious people are too easy to offend. Writing fiction about people making up fake religions...

Yes, I get it.
It's all fun and games until someone loses a lawsuit. Oh, and by the way, sending me private messages won't work. :/ If you must contact me, there's an e-mail address listed on the website in my profile.

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Post by Dave » May 31st, 2004, 9:05 pm

Elvish Pillager wrote:[
These religious people are too easy to offend. Writing fiction about people making up fake religions...

Yes, I get it.
Saying someone is 'too easy to offend' is very easy when you are not personally offended by what is being said. You are making gratuitous value judgements about other people.

Anyhow, since I am one of these 'religious people', I will not accept such 'religious sides' into the official Wesnoth release as long as I am the lead developer. You are welcome to make a modification of your own that implements them, of course.

David
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Post by Elvish_Pillager » May 31st, 2004, 9:06 pm

...Which is exactly what I was planning to do all along, of course.
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Post by Sangel » June 1st, 2004, 5:11 am

Let's leave religion out of Wesnoth.
"Pure logic is the ruin of the spirit." - Antoine de Saint-Exupéry

Michael

Post by Michael » June 1st, 2004, 8:25 am

turin wrote:It can be offensive that religion is something it is OK to joke about, to make up your own religion.
There are many religions that were "made up" by someone. The older they are, the harder it usually is to trace their origins, but all religions are made by men. Why would anyone be offended if a game uses a fake religion to enrich the cultural atmosphere? People who are extreme like this are probably unlikely to play a game where you "kill" other "people" anyway.
It can be offensive that religion is not taken seriously and a made up god is just as 'real' as your god.
I like to think that we have left the Middle Ages a while ago already. Certainly, there are still some fundamentalists about, but most modern, religious people are quite tolerant of other religions. Heck, one of my best friends is a Jehova Witness, and she's perfectly fine with my critical thoughts about her religion. She also plays computer games that feature "fake religions" and she doesn't mind. Neither does her husband, who is also a Jehova Witness. (Actually, I have to say that this couple greatly influenced my opinion of this sect/organization, because they never, not once, tried to "convert" me -- whenever religion becomes a topic, it's brought up solely by me.) Can you be more hardcore Christian today? I doubt it. ;)

Anyway, everything can be offensive. In Wesnoth you're killing other creatures, sometimes even humans! *gasps* I'm willing to bet that there are more people on this planet who have issues with killing living creatures than with following an obscure religion. I also believe that Wesnoth doesn't have to be "politically correct", which it probably isn't anyway. Aren't there more male sprites than female ones? I'm sure that'd offend a number of feminists.
Get it?
No. ;)

Seriously, I like the idea. Wesnoth is set in a medieval fantasy environment, and priests (or religion) generally plays a significant role in such settings. It would just add more depth to the game world. Also, names like Monk or Acolyte are fairly neutral and generic anyway, since they don't necessarily stand for any particular religion.

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Post by Roel » June 1st, 2004, 8:46 am

I don't see why anyone should be offended by some monks or priests or pelgrims in the game. After al there are shamans and in medieval-themed (wrong spelling?) themed fantasy games I would suspect to see some "religious" units.

I said I suspect to see them but I don't want to know what religion or an entire made up history.

Mika

Post by Mika » June 1st, 2004, 9:48 am

Elvish Pillager wrote:
Darth Fool wrote:Martyrs should be wimpy units that die like any other unit, only they cost less to recruit.
"Charge, my hordes of martyrs" doesn't sound quite right.
How about having "fanatics" instead. They could cost little, have powerful attack but little hp and poor resistance against most weapons.

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