Forgotten Kingdom

Discussion and development of scenarios and campaigns for the game.

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Limabean
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Re: Forgotten Kingdom

Post by Limabean »

-Problem comes in the fact that not only is the player sure they have to head south, but the sudden spawn of so many green troops/mercenaries in the way made it a close run thing. If I had had any less units... As it was, I only had about 12 left, and it was 5 and the leader that made a break for the cave (only ones close enough).
yeah, I was worried this particular part in the design might be a problem. I tried to compensate by giving the player an extra 26 gold on turn 16 (no announcement, did you notice?). I find that those two extra whelps + the orcish bodyguard + a few other units nearby are generally enough, although it is close. Maybe give more gold to make it a little easier?
I made it but my other forces got chewed to shreds.
one of the last changes I made to this before moving on to scenario 5 was to add a "bunker" of sorts for the player to hide his/her important units when the ai gets its reinforcements. It's just a square of impassable mountains (around 38,15) with one narrow entrance. If you can get any trolls in there, especially leveled ones, they can easily hold out till Orlog retreats to the cave. I only try to hold back the wave of enemy reinforcements for a little and then I go into a full retreat. Usually by the time I win there are ai everywhere except the bunker and the lower right hand corner near the cave.
-Green really does not need so many new troops. Or, spawn them on the castle but have them stay there. It got to the point where I was waiting for 97 green units to move before I could move my 7. That makes the AI turn take forever.
I very good point. I''ve changed the bonus gold for the ai from 500 (I guess I just got carried away :roll:) to 150
-Recall list is busted, the units multiply. To avoid an unfair advantage as I did not know how many were really mine, I did not recall any units (and still won.)

Scenario 5
-Not too far in yet, but there is a serious recall list issue. I believe that it has multiplied yet again, and so the number of units I have is amazing. Maybe this is intentional? But I do not think so.
yeah, this is a pretty frustrating problem :hmm:. It's basically the only thing stopping me from releasing scenario 8 and the various changes to the earlier ones. I'm fooling around with the [side] tags whenever I get a chance. I'll try using save_id and we'll see what happens.
When a scientist states that something is possible, he is almost certainly right. When he states that something is impossible, he is very probably wrong.
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Turuk
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Re: Forgotten Kingdom

Post by Turuk »

Limabean wrote:yeah, I was worried this particular part in the design might be a problem. I tried to compensate by giving the player an extra 26 gold on turn 16 (no announcement, did you notice?). I find that those two extra whelps + the orcish bodyguard + a few other units nearby are generally enough, although it is close. Maybe give more gold to make it a little easier?

:hmm: Not directly, but I remember thinking that I had more gold than I thought I did previously... Just chalked it up to me not paying attention. More gold.... eh well, it is never good to be like oops, player will not survive, let us just magically give him more money...
Limabean wrote:one of the last changes I made to this before moving on to scenario 5 was to add a "bunker" of sorts for the player to hide his/her important units when the ai gets its reinforcements. It's just a square of impassable mountains (around 38,15) with one narrow entrance. If you can get any trolls in there, especially leveled ones, they can easily hold out till Orlog retreats to the cave. I only try to hold back the wave of enemy reinforcements for a little and then I go into a full retreat. Usually by the time I win there are ai everywhere except the bunker and the lower right hand corner near the cave.
I did notice that, but my comment here has to deal with both of the above quotes. Really, given the issues with the recall list, I cannot give honest feedback on the outcome of the scenario. I will go back and play it using a handful of the goblin units and see if that makes a difference because I do believe that will drastically alter the outcome of the map. Having those pillagers with slow would have made a huge difference in taking out the mounted troops to the west, and their mobility would also have helped in dealing with the outlaws to the northeast. It might have made the difference in my defeat of purple to the very west(and holding green at that ford) and my stalemate with black to the very east.
Limabean wrote:yeah, this is a pretty frustrating problem . It's basically the only thing stopping me from releasing scenario 8 and the various changes to the earlier ones. I'm fooling around with the [side] tags whenever I get a chance. I'll try using save_id and we'll see what happens.
The funny part of this is that this is what usually happens to many UMC campaign authors, I have played many a campaign in the making that has issues with the recall list replicating over and over. I would try looking at more complete UMC work to see how the issues is dealt with in their work.
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Limabean
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Re: Forgotten Kingdom

Post by Limabean »

I will go back and play it using a handful of the goblin units and see if that makes a difference because I do believe that will drastically alter the outcome of the map. Having those pillagers with slow would have made a huge difference in taking out the mounted troops to the west, and their mobility would also have helped in dealing with the outlaws to the northeast. It might have made the difference in my defeat of purple to the very west(and holding green at that ford) and my stalemate with black to the very east.
well, it was not my intention for those goblin troops to be available in the first place so don't get used to using them :wink: . I plan on removing them whenever I figure out how to deal with this whole recall issue.
Not directly, but I remember thinking that I had more gold than I thought I did previously... Just chalked it up to me not paying attention. More gold.... eh well, it is never good to be like oops, player will not survive, let us just magically give him more money...
Ok, well, I could just spawn a few more ai helpers like the bodyguard. I guess it would make sense for a few more to be hanging around considering this is a fully populated orcish settlement.
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Turuk
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Re: Forgotten Kingdom

Post by Turuk »

Limabean wrote:well, it was not my intention for those goblin troops to be available in the first place so don't get used to using them . I plan on removing them whenever I figure out how to deal with this whole recall issue.
Perfect. I did not think so, given the dialogue to that point and the story, so that works out well then as I can continue testing the same as I have used no advantage so far any other player would not have had. So I would not have them in Scenario 5 either? Good, I will keep playing.
Limabean wrote:Ok, well, I could just spawn a few more ai helpers like the bodyguard. I guess it would make sense for a few more to be hanging around considering this is a fully populated orcish settlement.
This is a bit more believable, and just give them some dialogue like we must protect the warlord!
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jdp
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Re: Forgotten Kingdom

Post by jdp »

In the 'Chased Invaders' scenario the objective is to 'Defeat all enemy leaders', but there are only eight moves to do this. The advice at the beginning of the scenario is to hurry down the road, but one of the enemy leaders appears back at the starting point. Maybe I'm missing something obvious, but it seems impossible to defeat all the leaders.

I thought all the previous scenarios were excellent, but I'm confused by this one and would be glad of any guidance.
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Limabean
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Re: Forgotten Kingdom

Post by Limabean »

Oops, the 8 turns is a typo. It's supposed to be 28. :oops:
I'm really sorry about that, I don't know how I missed it. Do you know how to change it in the scenario .cfg?
its in userdata/data/campaigns/Forgotten Kingdom/scenarios/06_Chased_nvaders.cfg. The turns shold be fairly close to the top of the file.
I guess this means I'll have to upload a new version as soon as possibleeven though I havn't figured out the recall issue.
I'll do it later today when I have more time. :(


EDIT: Okay, new version uploaded. Some but not all of the changes discussed hae been implemented.
Most importantly though, i've fixed that god awful typo. Again, sorry about that.
Btw, if your just fixing it manually, the correct number of turns is 38, not 28 or 8.
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Turuk
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Re: Forgotten Kingdom

Post by Turuk »

That works out much better, the 20 (now 30) additional turns make for a huge difference in actually completing the scenario. :P
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Limabean
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Re: Forgotten Kingdom

Post by Limabean »

Good News! The recall/side-switching problem is fixed. I'm not quite sure what I did, but I was just fiddling around, went to test it, and found that it worked.
I've also finished scenario 8 and implemented all (I think) the changes discussed in this thread.

I'm looking forward to some feedback.
Enjoy! :D
When a scientist states that something is possible, he is almost certainly right. When he states that something is impossible, he is very probably wrong.
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Fightermick
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Re: Forgotten Kingdom

Post by Fightermick »

If it helps at all, I 1st noticed the recall problem at holding the crossings mission, The units affected are from before this mission. I'm now up to Holding The Border mission and no other units have been affected.

I was able to get all surviving units (12 or so) out in scenario 4. That was before your current update.

I was disappointed to see that there is no Lvl 3 for the Troll berserkers.

I'm quite enjoying this Campaign.
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Limabean
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Re: Forgotten Kingdom

Post by Limabean »

well, I was planning to release the next version and scenario today, but instead I have a very strange problem i'm hoping people can help me with.
First of all, it seems the whole recall issue was not as fixed as I thought. The orcs can in fact recall trolls and vice versa :(
My stranger problem has to do with the sides being mixed up.
Here's my [side] code for the 9th scenario:

Code: Select all

[side]
    type=Raid Captain
    description=Gashnu
    user_description= _ "Gashnu"
    unrenamable=yes
    profile=portraits/Gashnu.png
    team_name=Orcs
    side=1
    canrecruit=yes
    controller=human
    persistent=1
    save_id=Gashnu
    recruit=Wolf Rider, Goblin Spearman, Orcish Grunt, Orcish Archer, Orcish Assassin
    gold=150
    fog=yes
    shroud=no
    income=2
    village_gold=1
    {BLACK_FLAG}
[/side]
As you can see, it clearly states that Gashnu is the leader in this level, but somehow Orlog is the one that spawns in the beginning. I have absolutely no idea how the game came up with the idea of making the leader a troll considering that the scenario 9 [side] code is a copy and paste of the scenario 8 code, in which Gashnu IS the leader. Any advice would be much appreciated. :(

EDIT: and here's a quick little replay proving the impossible:
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FK-Friend_or_Foe_replay.gz
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Limabean
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Re: Forgotten Kingdom

Post by Limabean »

Great news! Thanks to OSJ's patient instruction and code the side switching issue has been resolved once and for all. :D
The latest version, which I just uploaded to the add-on menu, contains these fixes as well as scenario 9, also fixed.

Has anyone gotten through the later scenarios (5 and afterward)? I admit those are the ones i've playtested the least so i'm a bit anxious to hear what people have to say. They're far from perfect so please, speak up so I can improve them. :)

btw, to the moderators: I hope its ok that I keep necroing this thread to annouce additions/bugfixes. If not just say so.
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Turuk
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Re: Forgotten Kingdom

Post by Turuk »

Limabean wrote:btw, to the moderators: I hope its ok that I keep necroing this thread to annouce additions/bugfixes. If not just say so.
That is fine, as long as you do not double, triple, quadruple post. Just edit your previous post with any new material you might have, unless it is so radically different to warrant a new post. You can obviously post after me. ;)

On a side note, check your PMs.
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Fabian
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Re: Forgotten Kingdom

Post by Fabian »

Hi,

I justed played the campaign up to level 7 (crossing the borders)
The cave looks flooded with undead.

How to win this map, and what are the glowing seals for?
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Limabean
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Re: Forgotten Kingdom

Post by Limabean »

this is a very big scenario so first of all I suggest pulling out all the stops. No need to be thrifty with your gold. :wink:

depending on how many leveled units you have, you can either send troopsto both sides of the road or just choose one. On each side of the road there is a fairly weak dwarf team. In the beginning you should just ignore the undead. This shouldn't be very hard since they move much slower than you in caves. You should go south and kill the dwarf leader(s). Near each dwarf castle is a very helpful bonus that is specifically designed for dealing with undead. With these rewards you can then go north and beatbthe undead.

Alternatively, you could also just attack the undead directly. I tried this once and, although it was harder, I find that leveled trolls make short work of skeletons. If you can do that you'll beat it a lot faster and get an impressive early finish paycheck.

Either way, it is useful to know that the glowing seals open up extra entrances and let you surprise the undead leaders. If you're lucky you can take one or two of them out like that
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Maramros
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Re: Forgotten Kingdom

Post by Maramros »

In the prison break scenario, sorry, I can't remember which that is, I can get as far as taking out the elvish guard on the small island, but moving Horn (Goblin Impaler) to the fort does not make anything happen. Also, every turn, the camera moves to the imprisoned (Raid Captain) Gashnu, and I find it quite annoying, as I then have to move the camera back, and I can't use Gashnu at all.
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