Additional level 0s

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irrevenant
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Post by irrevenant »

thespaceinvader wrote:No women peasants. Why, you may ask... Because the units they level into do not have female alternates, and gender-shifting on levelling is not really good...
I keep seeing this logic. The trouble is it's self-perpetuating.

Noone will make female peasants because there are no female thugs or footpads. And noone will make female thugs or footpads because there are no female peasants for them to level from!

Why not make the female art for part of the line (especially if it's an easy tweak) to enable female art for the rest of the line?
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turin
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Post by turin »

Female footpads are a possibility, but female thugs are definitely not a good idea IMO...
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Federalist marshal
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Post by Federalist marshal »

Although this suggestion may prove controversial, but perhaps androgynous sprites are a possibility?
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JW
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Post by JW »

There are female footpads.
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thespaceinvader
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Post by thespaceinvader »

If someone's willing to do the art, the i don't mind it at all. But suggesting female peasants in particular means changing the entire spearman line, 6 units, literally dozens of sprites, and the bowman line, which in turn means the poacher line and woodsman need changing. Similarly, changing the thug would (theoretically), mean the brute needs changing, then the HI (not one i could easily see being female...).

Changing some units means virtually all the human units would need artwork changes. That's hundreds of sprites that would need changing, not to mention the vacuum which would be left for female portraits. If someone's willing to do the artwork to change all of them, then i'd welcome female alternates. Until then... You can get away with a solely male unit levelling into one which has female alternates (or vice versa). But you can't get away with a female unit levelling into one which has only male sprites, (or vice versa).
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db0
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Post by db0 »

turin wrote:Female footpads are a possibility, but female thugs are definitely not a good idea IMO...
Sexist! :mrgreen:

Women can be thuggish too...just ask my girlfriend...

just kiddin honey...please don't kill me...

:P
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Post by Weeksy »

Why do we need to have female options for level 0's just because we start making a level 1? Yes, it seems smoother, but it's the sort of thing that is explainable simply because of the gender-switch issue and lack of some units of some genders (no male sorceresses, for instance). Besides, we already have it in the game. No female ruffians (because we presumably don't want female thugs) and yet we have female footpads.
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Ken_Oh
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Post by Ken_Oh »

The thing is, female variants for everything but footpads and magi would most likely be different enough to be their own unit. A Thug would probably be more like the Outlaw Princess and a female loyalist fighter might look more like the Battle Princess than a Heavy Infantryman.

I'm all for making some alternative lvl 1s to go along with some female lvl 0s, but they'd sort of have to be separate units. But, remember that a parallel female lvl 0 unit could advance into existing lvl 1s with female genders. So a Woman Civilian could lvl into Thief. They just wouldn't have the option to level into Fencer.

Just a brainstorm for additional lvl 1s:
Noblewoman ---> Court Sword Dancer (like a fencer)
Woman Peasant ---> Lady Archer or Huntress (or something to that effect)
Woman Peasant/Woman Civilian ---> Town Defender (like Spearman)

btw: attached zip with transparent background pngs for the sprites
Last edited by Ken_Oh on January 21st, 2008, 4:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Federalist marshal
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Post by Federalist marshal »

Also, we don't have portraits for the proposed female sprites. Needless to say, a female spearman talking with the existing spearman portrait would be...awkward.
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Vendanna
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Post by Vendanna »

Federalist marshal wrote:Also, we don't have portraits for the proposed female sprites. Needless to say, a female spearman talking with the existing spearman portrait would be...awkward.
When something doesn't have a portrait I tought it would use the unit talking as default, no?

Also, the female variations would probably be done on a future date if not only because at the end the Base frames will finally gets done and I think the sprites would prefer to do female variants than directional frames. :p
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turin
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Post by turin »

db0 wrote:
turin wrote:Female footpads are a possibility, but female thugs are definitely not a good idea IMO...
Sexist! :mrgreen:

Women can be thuggish too...just ask my girlfriend...

just kiddin honey...please don't kill me...

:P
No, what would be sexist is if it was OK to have always female units (i.e. the Elvish Druid, the Mermaid Initiate) but not OK to have always male units. ;)
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db0
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Post by db0 »

turin wrote: No, what would be sexist is if it was OK to have always female units (i.e. the Elvish Druid, the Mermaid Initiate) but not OK to have always male units. ;)
Well, I guess it depends on what the theme of the faction is. If we take it that humans are like current humans, only medieval, then it doesn't make less sense to have a female thug. Given enough brawn, anyone can be a thug. However if in Elven culture the druids can only be females then it makes sense to keep them that way.

Now that I think of it, I could even argue that you should be able to get a male elven druid but in that case, his level path would change to something else instead of fairies, say for example "animalists".

Now that's a cool idea ;)
Last edited by db0 on January 21st, 2008, 6:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Stilgar
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Post by Stilgar »

turin wrote:No, what would be sexist is if it was OK to have always female units (i.e. the Elvish Druid, the Mermaid Initiate) but not OK to have always male units. ;)
I would totally draw a sprite of a half-naked elf guy with glittery fairy wings in response to that, if I weren't already being too lazy to make useful sprites.
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db0
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Post by db0 »

Master Stilgar wrote:
turin wrote:No, what would be sexist is if it was OK to have always female units (i.e. the Elvish Druid, the Mermaid Initiate) but not OK to have always male units. ;)
I would totally draw a sprite of a half-naked elf guy with glittery fairy wings in response to that, if I weren't already being too lazy to make useful sprites.
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Noyga
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Post by Noyga »

db0 wrote:
turin wrote:Female footpads are a possibility, but female thugs are definitely not a good idea IMO...
Sexist! :mrgreen:

Women can be thuggish too...just ask my girlfriend...

just kiddin honey...please don't kill me...

:P
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