Undead Campaign: Despair and Decay

Elvish_Pillager · Post by **Elvish_Pillager** » May 25th, 2006, 9:33 am

It was a pretty nice campaign, up until I got to Muck and Mire... which made me think: Don't you know how dams work?

When you open a dam, tons and tons of pent-up water crashes out, flooding everywhere. You got that down pretty well.

When you close a dam, all that released water does NOT spontaneously duck back behind it.

Post by **Ken_Oh** » May 25th, 2006, 10:53 am

WINR

I guess it might be more realistic to have the swamp drain bit by bit. That's something to consider but it's a little complicated.

Glad you liked the campaign otherwise.

toms · Post by **toms** » May 25th, 2006, 12:03 pm

If you close the dam, the water which spelt out stays out.

And the drain of the swamp can be done easily.
(store all swamp, iterate over the array, and pick one value of the array randomly. Thats all and please donÃ‚Â´t tell you dont know how to)

Post by **Ken_Oh** » May 25th, 2006, 7:32 pm

Right, I didn't mean complicated, just time consuming. I've got bigger fish to fry at the moment but I'll take it as a real consideration in the future.

It's conceivable that over the next day the water washes down the line to where ever it was flowing in the first place. I was also considering making pools of swamp that collect and stay even if it dries up.

Either way, gameplay trumps realism here. I wanted an objective that you would have to get and hold, one that would have negative consequences if you didn't hold it (i.e. you couldn't just fly a bat there and call it done....even though objectives like that aren't a bad idea either, would give those bats some kind of worth

).

whitewizard · Post by **whitewizard** » May 26th, 2006, 3:38 am

I don't claim to be very good using the undead race, but I played on easy and had my ass handed to me. Is it too hard for the easy mode? I will give it another try.

Post by **Ken_Oh** » May 26th, 2006, 3:56 am

I haven't really balanced the difficulties too much (if at all), but I've found all of them to be not too much trouble, except Sink or Swim, which I think needs to somehow give you a little more time for your Skels to cross. I'm probably just going to throw money at that problem.

What scenario(s) in particular gave you trouble?

whitewizard · Post by **whitewizard** » May 26th, 2006, 4:47 am

I did much better the second time once I got the strategy down. Still, it may be a tough campaign for extreme newbies.

flava_clown · Post by **flava_clown** » May 27th, 2006, 10:46 am

Truper wrote: All I meant about the temple events is that they were written by someone whose first language is not English. That isn't a problem, but I will help with some of the writing if you guys want me to.

it was my fault... i thought you talk about the 2 new events (in 0.2.1g)
and yes my english is damn bad, that's why i always say to ken that he should 'change' my texts. should i say the next time 'correct it'?

i am not pretty sure but i guess Ken Oh speaks english natively. or not?

@whitewizard: in the first scenarios the key to victory are the walking corpses. make sure that you recruit at least one, to gain more WCs for free.
in SoS recall the skels and archer. a little hint: if you move '????' to a special place then you can get a skel for free, which got also the loyal trait. just keep in mind that our hero can reanimate corpses (bones) ... however this doesn't work always but in SoS for sure

in HH forget your recall list and use ghosts there!

@Ken Oh: i don't think that the skels need more time to cross. they fight very well on the 'shallow'(?) water. and they shouldn't be skels anymore. normaly i have there 6-8 level 2 units.
btw. i am not from spain! i live in spain coz it's really nice here and i like the language but i am still a german

i've made a little image yesterday, since i really want to make a scenario now, but dunno where you want it. take a look and tell me then where exactly, maybe with an image like this...

@Elvish Pillager: about Muck and Mire... come on, you talk about realism, when do you have seen the last time an undead? or a talking bat? this is just a game. everything is possible there, if we want it. the idea is to give the ghouls an advantage if you can hold the dam house. if the swamp dries right now then it's not realistic but it's the right punishment for not keeping the dam house! if we change it in a more realistic way then it is no longer really necessary to hold the dam house. imho...

SunTzu · Post by **SunTzu** » May 27th, 2006, 4:22 pm

Hmm, i saw that prob too with the Dam.
However, if it was realistic, it would only take sending many bats there to take the dam house and then its done; It would romove the tactical importance of holding that position.

Even if its unrealistic, i prefer it as its now.

Grey_Wolf_c · Post by **Grey_Wolf_c** » May 28th, 2006, 2:10 pm

Hi, couple of bugs:

1) The first scenario crashes when a villager makes for the boat. Playing the Easy campaign (I love the game, but I suck at playing it

).
2) Have left my leader and several trops at villages for one turn (or more) to regenerate and no WCs. If I understand correctly, capturing a village with my leader should give me, at the start of the next turn, a WC? At any rate, I have waited for two turns in the same spot and nothing.

By the way... that temple/weird structure in the middle of the forest - is is meant to have some kind of special event associated to it? Again, I went for a visit and waited for a turn and nothing happened either.

Also, at least on easy, WCs are completely unnecesary since all you face are pikemen and archers and skellies make short work of both since the best they can hurt you is for 4 in broad daylight. I've taken my time and leveled both leader and troops quite a bit with no danger - at night pikement manage 2 damage per attack.

I'm playing the latest version (1.1.3), using Mac OS X 10.4.6 and I don't get any error messages when the application crashes (except the standard "something crashed - want to send a message to Apple?"). The campaign is looking great, and I hope the crash can be solved easily so I can continue.

Thanks,

Grey Wolf

Grey_Wolf_c · Post by **Grey_Wolf_c** » May 28th, 2006, 3:31 pm

I just decided to give a try on medium difficulty (since someone mentioned it fixed it before in the thread) and still no WCs when I stay at villages. On this dfficulty you do seem to need them, too, since I was a little shorthanded on troops an the enemy humans easily flanked me. At any rate, whatever the bug is, it is present in both easy end medium.

In case it matters, when I installed the newest version of Wesnoth I didn't bother to delete the old one before, but I did delete all the campaigns and saved games and I had not downloaded this campaign before anyway.

Hope that helps,

Grey Wolf

Post by **Ken_Oh** » May 28th, 2006, 6:36 pm

Hey, I'm not at home so I'll only handle what I can from here.

1. Yes, I was born and raise American, though I study Chinese and plan to live in China for at least a year in a few months. Also lived in Africa for 2 years but that's besides the point.

2. Nice map. Scenarios 1-4 are in the north (maybe off the map or just inside the north part of the map). From the Isle ???? travels north to Elensefar; Random Encounter is in that woods where you have that Elven Archer (I think). Basically, when Delfador goes away to meet some Elven Council and comes back with Kalenz to Elensefar, you'll meet Delfador on his way out towards the Elves. From there Scenario 8 will be north of the great river and then ???? will get some time to rest up before heading south to Weldyn, just in time to meet up with Konrad fighting the Dark Queen (in 2 alternate endings).

Scenario 8 might want to be one of the maps in the north with undead on them from HttT (Valley of the Dead or that swamp one). Maybe we should just put 2 scenarios in there, one from HttT and another brand new one just because it does make sense to go straight from Elensefar to Weldyn.

3. About the OSX problems. I don't know if installing versions of Wesnoth over each other is an issue for OSX. Ive only played 1.1.2 on OSX so I never got to see. I'll try using the new one to see if anything breaks. I wish the game gave us more feedback though.

Grey_Wolf_c · Post by **Grey_Wolf_c** » May 28th, 2006, 10:47 pm

I wish the game gave us more feedback though

Very much agreed. In fact, given that it is a development build and not a stable one, I find it extremelly strange that there isn't a log. So strange, in fact, that I'm willing to bet that there is a log somewhere I could check to see what went wrong just before it crashed. But I don't know this forum, or the wesnoth development team, enough to know where I could ask about such log. Sorry I cannot help more, but it is easily reproductible. I also have plenty of save points, should you need them.

Hope that helps,

Grey Wolf

Edit: tags

Truper · Post by **Truper** » May 29th, 2006, 3:21 pm

About the Walking Corpses: you need to put a Walking Corpse on a village to generate more Corpses, not your leader or another troop.

Post by **Ken_Oh** » May 29th, 2006, 4:28 pm

Agreed about thinking there must be a log somewhere. If no one answers it here, I'll ask in IRC when I get back home.

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Undead Campaign: Despair and Decay

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Couple of bugs

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