09 - Bounty Hunters

Feedback for the mainline single-player campaign Legend of Wesmere.

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thebends43201
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Re: V1.9/1.10 - 09 - Bounty Hunters

Post by thebends43201 »

[quote="Content Feedback"]The Legend of Wesmere, scenario 9 - Bounty Hunters:

(1) What difficulty levels and what version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on? 1.12.2, hardest
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10) 2
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives? fine

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario? fine

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario? Years back I played on medium, and iirc you can actually recruit some guardians and bunker up in the southeast, and get a bit of experience. I tried that here but on hard not only do the oracles decimate you, but the skirmishers catch Kalenz rather easily. I tried giving him just 2-3 scouts as escorts, but that as never enough. So the only way to get through it is the kinda boring "recruit and run" strategy, sacrificing everyone as needed. On the very final turn you can fight back, but I didn't get any kills for my guys.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10) 1. You don't recall anyone (though I did recally aa shyde, it was unnecessary), and you get no experience for anyone new.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun? I hate to say this, because some awesome people put in so much hard work for this game, but as played, this scenario is pointless. If there was a way to actually get a decent round or two of fighting that'd be fine, but at the moment it's just run, you can't fight back.

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario? goofing around stated above
Caladbolg
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Re: V1.9/1.10 - 09 - Bounty Hunters

Post by Caladbolg »

I'll start with a few words on the "Council of Hard Choices" as it has no thread on its own, being story-only scenario.
Spoiler:
As for "Bounty Hunters":

(1) What difficulty levels and what version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
1.12.5., medium.

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
5. My strategy was very simple- recruit and run. Positioning baits wasn't that much trouble either. All in all, it would be a 4 maybe but I'm giving it a higher grade because I got lucky with one sea monster and managed to kill it right off the bat which was really helpful.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
It's all good. I like the little bits of foreshadowing in Landar's dialog (in scenarios before too, I forgot to mention that in my feedbacks).

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Keeping the main cast away from saurians. I'm begining to think that they are the supreme race of wesnoth.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
Hard to decide. On one hand, I don't like the fact that I couldn't advance any units (and even moreso that most of the xp from sea creatures was wasted on my lvl 3s). On the other hand, that makes it stand out somewhat. Not every scenario needs to benefit the player. 5 I'd say.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
As it is, the player makes a run for it, leaving a few units along the way for distraction. That's fine and all but due to low gold you have few units and thus there are few fights to be had. The low number of fights makes the scenario more susceptible to luck which is bad in a scenario where every bit of delay helps. I'd suggest slightly upping the player's gold and expanding all starting castles by 1, while also adding more base income for saurians. Hopefully, they'd still be able to exert enough pressure to force you to flee but you'd be able to field more units which means more battles and less luck dependance. Turn limit could also be lowered (I finished on 8/28).

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
No, but I did do a short 3-turn trial run to get a feel for the dynamics in this scenario considering that the map is small and saurians are a hastle.

Strategy: Recalled units will like be killed, so instead I just recruited the cheapest units (elf/dwarf fighters and shamans) and ran. Guardsmen and woses may be more durable, but it's not that much of a difference and they'll all die anyways so it's better to go cheap. Recruits scatter around to be killed at a nice distance from my main cast. On the 5th turn Cleodil triggers monsters. On the 6th I get lucky and Cleodil and a sharpshooter get all their hits, killing a squid and making the endgame easier. Kalenz was put in water in reach of a squid and a serpent but he can survive even if they get all hits (it still sucks when they hit 11/12). Olurf gets to kill a squid and an oracle so this wasn't a complete waste. Ended on 8th turn.

Stats: start gold 230, end gold 102, 1/24 villages, 5 units on map, 3 income per turn, ended on 8/28 turn, 12 recruits and losses, 5 kills, +8% dmg dealt, -3% dmg received (big difference is due to a low number of fights).
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LoW-Bounty_Hunters_replay.gz
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devavrata
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Re: V1.9/1.10 - 09 - Bounty Hunters

Post by devavrata »

Content Feedback wrote:The Legend of Wesmere, scenario 9 - Bounty Hunters:

(1) What difficulty levels and what version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
Battle for Wesnoth 1.8.3, Easy/Medium, Battle for Wesnoth 1.10.7 Hard.
Content Feedback wrote:(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
6
Content Feedback wrote:(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear
Content Feedback wrote:(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Clear
Content Feedback wrote:(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Fighting saurians is always a challenge because their skirmish ability to ignore zones of control... oh wait, in this scenario they seem not to skirmish.
Still, they are dangerous - they get four spear attacks or four magical attacks each, they can deal a lot of damage.
I decided to stay at the forest and wait for them - only to find that they would randomly disseminate all around the map. Some were seemingly intent on seizing villages, but others just seemed to be roaming around. After I started fighting the first saurians in the forest, the rest of them did come along - their dispersion allowed me to fight them in small quantities.
Content Feedback wrote:(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
5
Content Feedback wrote:(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Better saurian strategy.
Content Feedback wrote:(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
No
Content Feedback wrote:(9) If you know a bit of the Wesnoth Markup Language - do you think that the WML of this scenario is clear and well commented? If not which part would you like to be documented better?
-
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octalot
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Re: V1.13/1.14 - 09 - Bounty Hunters

Post by octalot »

I managed to kill both saurians, but on medium and starting with a full set of loyals. For this reason, I haven't rated the difficulty, as I haven't tried playing the scenario as it's meant to be played.

(1) What difficulty levels and what version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
Medium, trunk around 1.13.10/1.13.11
Starting with all of the loyal units available so far in the campaign still alive (several back-a-few-turns reloads earlier in the campaign, always for a change of tactics not just for the RNG).

(3 & 8 ) How clear did you find the scenario objectives? Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
Clear, run or get overwhelmed. Still I felt like trying to fight, so had two attempts where I tried to split my forces east and west, and then a successful attempt of sending my full forces to the east first.

The third attempt cost me both of my loyal lv3 elvish riders, but having read the thread here those seem painful but acceptable losses to me.

I wasn't expecting the scenario to end when the second saurian died, which happened on the 15th turn.
Attachments
LoW-Bounty Hunters replay.gz
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Heroofnone
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Re: V1.9/1.10 - 09 - Bounty Hunters

Post by Heroofnone »

The Legend of Wesmere, scenario 9 - Bounty Hunters:

(1) What difficulty levels and what version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?

1.14.1

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario?

it doesnt work

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?

very clear, alas my hero is missing so I cant fulfil the requirement

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?

seems clear

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?

Kalenz is missing

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)

a welcome change of action after the last endless battle

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?

maybe the saurians could fight eachother ?

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?

Kalenz is missing reloading did not help, I completed the last scenario on turn 10 there was an error about failing to end scenario, but then the dwarves appeared (I had already won tho strangely, maybe he should have shown up a bit earlier) and I got all that dialogue and everything seemed fine until I started the next scenario (bounty hunters), I made an effort to keep all loyal tagged units alive, maybe there is not enough room for Kalenz ? I play on highest difficulty

(9) If you know a bit of the Wesnoth Markup Language - do you think that the WML of this scenario is clear and well commented? If not which part would you like to be documented better?

I don't know this
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octalot
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Re: V1.9/1.10 - 09 - Bounty Hunters

Post by octalot »

Please would you post either the replay or the final autosave from the previous scenario, Heroofnone?
Heroofnone
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Re: V1.9/1.10 - 09 - Bounty Hunters

Post by Heroofnone »

octalot wrote: May 19th, 2018, 7:27 am Please would you post either the replay or the final autosave from the previous scenario, Heroofnone?
ok, hope this helps, I was going to try an drag out the previous scenario a bit longer to see if that fixes the problem, but before I do that heres the replay and last save, the replay stops with an error at turn 10: "found dependent command in_replay while is_synced=false", when ending the turn of the last autosave in the upper left corner appears: "<lua> Repeated [endlevel] execution, ignoring"

edit: I skipped via debugmode to the next scenario after bounty hunters and Kalenz reappeared
Attachments
LoW-Elves’ Last Stand replay.gz
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LoW-Elves’ Last Stand-Auto-Save10.gz
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elttab-thonsew
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Re: V1.9/1.10 - 09 - Bounty Hunters

Post by elttab-thonsew »

Hi,
I am new to this forum. I have the same issue as mentioned by Heroofnone.

Wesnoth 1.14.1
LoW-Elves’ Last Stand-Auto-Save18.gz
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LoW-Elves’ Last Stand replay.gz
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octalot
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Re: V1.9/1.10 - 09 - Bounty Hunters

Post by octalot »

Thanks for the save-games. It seems this is already fixed in the changes prepared for 1.14.2.

The start-of-scenario saves for Bounty Hunters will have this bug when loaded by 1.14.1, so attached are saves at the start of turn 1, which load successfully on 1.14.1.


Findings during debugging:

* The bug happens with 1.14.1, but doesn't happen with 1.14.0, and it doesn't happen with 1a3625d, the current-work-in-progress towards 1.14.2.
* There were no changes (other than an update of shadowm's name) to the data/campaigns/LoW/ folder between 1.14.0 and 1.14.1.
* With all of 1.14.0, 1.14.1 and 1a3625d there are warnings about the repeated [endlevel], and (only on the console) "Unknown attribute 'previous_save_id' discarded".
* The start-of-scenario save from 1.14.1 works when loaded by 1a3625d.
* The start-of-scenario save from 1d3625d has the bug when loaded by 1.14.1.
Attachments
heroofnone-LoW-Bounty Hunters Turn 1.gz
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eittab-thonsew-LoW-Bounty Hunters Turn 1.gz
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elttab-thonsew
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Re: V1.9/1.10 - 09 - Bounty Hunters

Post by elttab-thonsew »

Thank you so much octalot for resolving the issue :-).
elttab-thonsew
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Re: V1.9/1.10 - 09 - Bounty Hunters

Post by elttab-thonsew »

@octalot game is running perfect but there is a message appearing on my screen during gameplay after using "eittab-thonsew-LoW-Bounty Hunters Turn 1.gz":

<Invalid WML Found> unknown conditional wml: [debug_status](4)
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octalot
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Re: V1.9/1.10 - 09 - Bounty Hunters

Post by octalot »

That debug_status seems to be an issue in the Gui Debug Tools add-on, here's new versions of the save files without it:
Attachments
heroofnone-LoW-Bounty Hunters Turn 1.gz
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elttab-LoW-Bounty Hunters Turn 1.gz
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Hestelvar
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Re: 09 - Bounty Hunters

Post by Hestelvar »

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
1.14.5
Solider (Easy)
Starting Gold 280
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
3. By recruiting mostly level 2’s and defeating both enemy leaders.
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Misleading! I won without Kalenz crossing the River. On easy difficulty running seems unnecessary.
Either add Defeat Enemy Leaders as an alternative victory condition or require Kalenz to cross the river even after the Saurians are gone.
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialogue and storyline of the scenario?
As dialogue I can’t fault it! But I found it misleading given how the scenario unfolded. See changes.
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
None.
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
5. I like the idea of this scenario, but in the end felt cheated of the challenge I’d anticipated.
(7) What, if any, are the changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
The western force dispersed over the map, grabbing village and almost ignoring their stated quarry. If this isn’t deliberate I think the AI should be tweaked to prioritise the elves, who after all have a bounty on their heads.
Is there any story reason why Saurians fording the river don’t trigger the appearance of the water monsters?
(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
None.
(9) If you know a bit of the Wesnoth Markup Language - do you think that the WML of this scenario is clear and well commented? If not which part would you like to be documented better?
N/a
Remarks:

I attacked the eastern enemy immediately, hoping to defeat him before I became surrounded by the western force. As this didn’t happen the actual combat went far more smoothly than I’d expected. Once the eastern front was secure I could pick rest off is one and two’s.
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LoW-Bounty Hunters replay.gz
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Konrad2
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Re: 09 - Bounty Hunters

Post by Konrad2 »

(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?

1.15.3, High Lord (Challenging)

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)

8

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?

Clear.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?

Clear.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?

Figuring out how to block the Saurians on the right without incurring relevant losses.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)

5

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?

How about removing the creatures that spawn in the river? At the very least remove the Cuttlefish, that on is supposed to live in deep water, not in some shallow river. ._.

Scenario stats:
Spoiler:
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LoW-Bounty Hunters replay.gz
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Zrevnur
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Re: 09 - Bounty Hunters

Post by Zrevnur »

Content Feedback wrote: September 10th, 2010, 3:35 pm The Legend of Wesmere, scenario 9 - Bounty Hunters:

(1) What difficulty levels and what version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
Wesnoth 1.14.11, High Lord (Challenging), no reloading during campaign, played the scenario at least twice
Content Feedback wrote: September 10th, 2010, 3:35 pm (2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
5 but difficulty is rather unfair due to the surprise scripting.
Content Feedback wrote: September 10th, 2010, 3:35 pm (3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
The gold carryover says plus-40% scheme but far as I remember this is wrong and it uses 80% all-or-nothing scheme.
Content Feedback wrote: September 10th, 2010, 3:35 pm (4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
It doesnt make sense: Why does only Kalenz have to cross? How does that magically get rid of the following saurians and the then-potentially-blocking sea monsters?
Content Feedback wrote: September 10th, 2010, 3:35 pm (5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
None.
Content Feedback wrote: September 10th, 2010, 3:35 pm (6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
3
Content Feedback wrote: September 10th, 2010, 3:35 pm (7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Saurians arent very fun to play against.
Nothing much going on.
I dislike the messing with the recall list. This scenario isnt the worst in that though.
Content Feedback wrote: September 10th, 2010, 3:35 pm (8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
No.
Attachments
LoW-Bounty Hunters replay.gz
(56.48 KiB) Downloaded 267 times
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