Scenario Review: Liberty 3 - A Strategy of Hope

Feedback for the mainline campaign Liberty.

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Linthar
Posts: 77
Joined: September 14th, 2006, 12:16 am

Re: Scenario Review: Liberty 3 - A Strategy of Hope

Post by Linthar »

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
1.10.7 Difficult

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
4.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Things start to get interesting around this point. The changing of the names of all the unit types from the custom names used for the previous two maps to the generic outlaw units was a really nice touch as well.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
It's a two front battle against a large force of level 1 orcs and a small force of level 2 saurians. It could have been rough, except there was plenty of good defensive terrain to fight the orcs in, and my ally was capable of holding off the saurians long enough for me to defeat the orcs and bring my army to bear.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
7. It's a good solid battle.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
It's fine as it is.

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
No.
fareley
Posts: 66
Joined: September 10th, 2008, 5:45 pm

Re: Scenario Review: Liberty 3 - A Strategy of Hope

Post by fareley »

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
1.12.0 Hard no reloads

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
Solid 7. The saurians killed my ally every single time I left them alone to play (more or less fast depending on if my ally starts recruiting a T3 unit). But giving up 3 Footpads and Harper left me vulnerable on the orc frontier. As it turned out recruiting nothing but Poachers to make use of the terrain (Thugs just die way too fast) finally did the job.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear enough.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
They were okay I guess. It was interesting to have a saurian and an orc join forces to take care of some bandits, but it was fine.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Not having the orc front crumble while part of the money flows towards keeping the saurians in check.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
7 - it can be a real challenge but I really dig the terrain where you fight against the orcs. Swamp is fun :)

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Give the ally a reliable better initial recruitment. Maybe swap places with the ally and have him help against the orcs where his arrows actually make sense.

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
Lucky orcs during the night. Orcs in general just smashing through one part of the defense and everything died.

(9) If you know a bit of the Wesnoth Markup Language - do you think that the WML of this scenario is clear and well commented? If not which part would you like to be documented better?
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tr0ll
Posts: 551
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Re: Scenario Review: Liberty 3 - A Strategy of Hope

Post by tr0ll »

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?

1.13.6 normal

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)

3

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?

very

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?

only intro and outro, no dialog, straightforward.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?

none

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)

5

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?

smaller map or add some incventive to get to the far corners

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?

no
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Konrad2
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Posts: 3330
Joined: November 24th, 2010, 6:30 pm

Re: Scenario Review: Liberty 3 - A Strategy of Hope

Post by Konrad2 »

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?

Difficult, 1.14.0

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)

5

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?

Absolutely.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?

Straightforward. Clear, but not the most intersting.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?

Knowing when my lines would break if I try to hold them.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)

5

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
-

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
-
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LordWolfDan
Posts: 216
Joined: September 30th, 2018, 7:31 am

Re: Scenario Review: Liberty 3 - A Strategy of Hope

Post by LordWolfDan »

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?

- 1.14.5, Easy

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)

- 4

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?

- Clear, kill the enemy leaders

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?

- It's good, I say. When you kill both leaders, I like how Baldras is concerned by the fact that orcs are now under queen's orders

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?

- None really. I only sent two bandits and Harper (who's outlaw by this scenario) against saurians while the rest of army went against orcs

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)

- 5

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?

- Killing either enemy leader would make the other one get more income so there's a bigger challenge

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?

- None
YanTanTethera
Posts: 9
Joined: July 11th, 2018, 11:41 am

Re: Scenario Review: Liberty 3 - A Strategy of Hope

Post by YanTanTethera »

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
Difficult, version 1.14.5.

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
7, since my southern front almost collapsed, and finishing within turn limit was pretty hard, too.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear as can be.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Harper says in the dialog that several riders escaped the battelfield of the scenario before. Maybe this could actually be made part of the storyline before?
Apart from that, both dialog and storyline are fine.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Reaching the Saurian leader in time, after almost all my forces where bound on the Southern front. I left most villages to Relana, though, since I felt like she needed them more.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
It’s a nice two-front battle on interesting terrain under time pressure, so I’ll give it a 7.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Having the Saurian head-quarter a little closer by would have been nice.

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
Not this time, no.
Zrevnur
Posts: 117
Joined: January 11th, 2020, 12:04 pm

Re: Scenario Review: Liberty 3 - A Strategy of Hope

Post by Zrevnur »

Content Feedback wrote: March 10th, 2008, 11:52 pm (1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
1.14.9, Fugitive (Difficult) (in Ironman mode), played several times
Content Feedback wrote: March 10th, 2008, 11:52 pm (2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
3, made some tactical mistakes in replay, RNG was on my side in the replay, maybe its a bit harder usually
Content Feedback wrote: March 10th, 2008, 11:52 pm (3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear.
Content Feedback wrote: March 10th, 2008, 11:52 pm (4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Ok.
Content Feedback wrote: March 10th, 2008, 11:52 pm (5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
None.
Content Feedback wrote: March 10th, 2008, 11:52 pm (6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
7
Content Feedback wrote: March 10th, 2008, 11:52 pm (7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
The AI instructions should get a 'help' sub menu which clearly explains what effects they have. Based on me using some (I think in another scenario) I am not even sure those instructions have any effect at all. The AI mindlessly throws its units at the "best" target no matter whether I tell it to be "defensive" or not.
Content Feedback wrote: March 10th, 2008, 11:52 pm (8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
No, I played campaign without reloading and scenario restarting.
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IceTyp
Posts: 21
Joined: August 23rd, 2020, 4:33 pm

Re: Scenario Review: Liberty 3 - A Strategy of Hope

Post by IceTyp »

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
Fugitive (Difficult), 1.15.5
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
3
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
clear
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
clear
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
I had no major challenges.
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
4
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
When I reached to pot of water in the southwest with Harper, it was not clear to me what this pot did.
It would be great, if there is some message that tells me what changed. Such a message could also be added to similar events in the other scenarios of this campaign.
(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
no
Konrad2
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Posts: 3330
Joined: November 24th, 2010, 6:30 pm

Re: Scenario Review: Liberty 3 - A Strategy of Hope

Post by Konrad2 »

(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?

1.15.5, Outlaw (Normal), 1.15.6, Fugitve (Hard)

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)

5

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?

Clear.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?

I liked it. :)

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?

Beating the orcs, not quite major, but still a challenge to do without throwing units away.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)

5, thanks for the water that inreasing my hp by 1. xD

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?

-

Scenario stats normal:
Spoiler:
Scenario stats hard:
Spoiler:
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Lord-Knightmare
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Re: Scenario Review: Liberty 3 - A Strategy of Hope

Post by Lord-Knightmare »

Content Feedback wrote: March 10th, 2008, 11:52 pm (1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
1. Normal (the middle one), Wesnoth 1.15.11+dev
2. 7
3. 10/10
4. I guess it's no surprise that the provinces of Delwyn and Dalben are under Elensefar's jurisdiction rather than Wesnothian, so the forced controlling of such frontiers would suggest the Queen trying to compel Elensefar into a submissive arrangement, rather than a treaty.
5. Trying to the orcs to break their formation so I could break their formation and ranks in 1-2 turns. Got a little lucky.
6. 7/10. It's nice since I got the opportunity to level up some units here.
7. None. It's good as it is.
8. Not really, no.
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Remellion
Posts: 51
Joined: December 25th, 2015, 3:18 pm

Re: Scenario Review: Liberty 3 - A Strategy of Hope

Post by Remellion »

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
1.15.14, Outlaw (Normal). Also sometime back in 1.12 or something.

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
3/10. Generous carryover gold and relatively impoverished enemies make for a good scenario to level up troops in.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Perfectly clear.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Great writing, interesting dynamic between the allies and us, and between the enemies.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Knowing how to split the troops initially - village-grabbing, NW, and SE.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
8/10. Interesting map. Nice touch that Relana recruits the neutral versions of the outlaw units. Relatively sparse enemies that mostly ended up weakened by dusk. But there was another fun easter egg!

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Not really anything.

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
No.
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mal_shubertal
Posts: 93
Joined: December 1st, 2018, 6:58 pm

Re: Scenario Review: Liberty 3 - A Strategy of Hope

Post by mal_shubertal »

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
1.16.2 Fugitive (Challenging)
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
3. Neither enemy has much gold, and your ally is pretty effective on her own, so it's not too challenging.
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
very
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
clear. As with the other scenarios, I like the regional diction of these characters, but it seems to switch on and off from one sentence to the next, to the point that it's distracting! I also like Relana's portrait, and the idea that these country folk are so tough that even their little old ladies can beat an orc to death with a stick.
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Just deciding how to split my forces for the fastest finish.
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
4. It's an interesting concept, fighting a two-front battle against very different factions in difficult terrain. But the enemies get so little gold and you get so much that you can just charge straight at both keeps at the same time and it's almost boring. I do like the addition of the little pitcher easter egg, although it is definitely the most trivial bonus so far!
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
I think this is a case where making it harder would actually make it more fun. It's a huge map with lots of villages, but because there are so few enemy units and you have so much starting gold, there isn't much point in scouting and village grabbing. I think that giving the opponents more starting gold, and maybe making the orcs more inclined to buy wolves and the saurians more inclined to buy skirmishers, would lead to a more interesting scenario where you need to manage resources and make tough decisions about where to concentrate your forces at what time.
(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
JL42
Posts: 66
Joined: December 9th, 2023, 11:19 am

Re: Scenario Review: Liberty 3 - A Strategy of Hope

Post by JL42 »

What difficulty levels and game versions have you played the scenario on?
v. 1.16.10
Fugitive / Challenging
How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
4
How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Mostly clear. Similar to the other maps I think the "special" objective in the south needs some kind of clarification regarding its existence and who can benefit from it. There was also a really weird comment when a unit moves down near the lake and Baldras randomly says, "I don't like the look of that water." I expected a monster to pop out or something but it never happened. Not sure if this is supposed to be an oblique reference to the bottle, but in any case it was weird and confusing.
How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Ugh.
What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
The main challenge is having to split up our forces, because there's not enough time to defeat the leaders one after the other, plus the ally can sometimes get overrun. I found that the time factor was very pressing and made me take risks that I otherwise wouldn't have. But, that's generally a good thing since it makes the gameplay exciting against what otherwise would be weak enemies. The general map concept of a two-front battle is really interesting and fun here.
How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
7 if you don't read the dialog.
What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Fix/revert the writing, and add some kind of notice about the "special objective" in the south.

---------------
About the Overall Campaign:

The maps in this campaign are generally solid and well-done. I like the revisions to the last few scenarios; these are big changes but they seem like an improvement over the old maps. Challenging, interesting, and well-balanced.

But, ugh ... the writing! The "dialect" here feels horribly off and inconsistent. The characters sound like some kind of city-slicker's sarcastic, mocking fantasy of rural people. (A lot of it actually sounds to me more like caricatured Urban Black English, rather than rural speech patterns; but it's false and inconsistent regardless.) Makes it very hard to develop sympathy and identity for the heroes because they come across as goofy caricatures. It's really difficult to write dialect without these problems so I would suggest just not doing it.

In addition, Baldras now comes across mostly as a sad-sack, with no real integrity, ingenuity, agency, or legitimate grievance. It just reeks of the attitude that these people, the actual heroes, are inept and dumb. Also, I understand wanting to make the ending more optimistic, but this also really weakens and eviscerates the story. There are still some high points, like the Monty Python references, but I seem to remember liking this one much better in the past, with the story being its high point. Now it just feels like a bad joke making fun of rural folks; completely ruins the enjoyment.

The "points of interest" throughout the various scenarios are a good addition, but it would be better if they were flagged somehow. Either with a graphical label ("Harper's Spare Bag") or through dialogue ("I left my bag in the northwest; if I can make it up there to pick it up then I'll be able to throw more rocks!") These work well as tactical objectives – deciding if it's worth leaving the battle to go after them – but it was kind of annoying to have to struggle to figure out what they actually do and who needs to go there. Eventually I just looked at the walkthrough for that information, but to avoid pointless hassles it should be clarified in the game itself.

Overall I'd give this campaign 3 out of 5 stars; it would be a lot higher if it weren't for the painful writing. The maps themselves are generally good.
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