Scenario 4: Bay of Pearls

Feedback for the mainline campaign Heir to the Throne.

Moderator: Forum Moderators

Post Reply
User avatar
Poison
Posts: 171
Joined: August 13th, 2017, 4:54 pm

Re: Scenario 4: Bay of Pearls

Post by Poison »

(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?

1.14.7, Champion (Challenging), 288 gold

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)


6, knights (and shamans) shine here too.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?

Clear.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?

Clear. You get help at the beginning to see the far away cage.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?

None.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)

A 9, very interesting battle.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Not much to change there.

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?

No but I rolled back a round because i didn't optimize damage (when i save the scout)
Attachments
HttT-The Bay of Pearls replay Poison.gz
(36.98 KiB) Downloaded 418 times
Zrevnur
Posts: 117
Joined: January 11th, 2020, 12:04 pm

Re: Scenario 4: Bay of Pearls

Post by Zrevnur »

Content Feedback wrote: September 9th, 2004, 2:07 am (1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
1.14.9 Challenging (in Ironman mode), played many times, 274 gold on replay
Content Feedback wrote: September 9th, 2004, 2:07 am (2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
4, I think objectively its harder if I want to preserve all/most loyal mermen but the way I prepare and play it its on the easier side
Content Feedback wrote: September 9th, 2004, 2:07 am (3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear.
Content Feedback wrote: September 9th, 2004, 2:07 am (4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Clear. Between silly and ok.
Content Feedback wrote: September 9th, 2004, 2:07 am (5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
No major challenges. This is preparation for 'Siege of Elensefar' - get as much gold as possible.
Content Feedback wrote: September 9th, 2004, 2:07 am (6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
6. I dont like the water gameplay vs the nagas though.
Content Feedback wrote: September 9th, 2004, 2:07 am (7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Maybe more reefs and some small islands so that its not all open water vs the nagas and bats. To compensate for the reduced difficulty AI could get a bit more gold.
Attachments
HttT-The Bay of Pearls replay.gz
(40.37 KiB) Downloaded 416 times
User avatar
Lord-Knightmare
Discord Moderator
Posts: 2337
Joined: May 24th, 2010, 5:26 pm
Location: Somewhere in the depths of Irdya, gathering my army to eventually destroy the known world.
Contact:

Re: Scenario 4: Bay of Pearls

Post by Lord-Knightmare »

Content Feedback wrote: September 9th, 2004, 2:07 am (1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
1. Normal/1.15.12+dev
2. 7/10
3. crystal clear
4. 7/10
5. trying to get those pesky bats. -_-
6. 6/10
9. This is probably one of the few scenarios where merfolk are added and can be used. It's a shame I have so many loyal merfolk and yet won't be able to use them for most of the campaign.
HttT-The Bay of Pearls replay 20210422-230228.gz
(35.15 KiB) Downloaded 191 times
Creator of "War of Legends"
Creator of the Isle of Mists survival scenario.
Maintainer of Forward They Cried
User:Knyghtmare | My Medium
mal_shubertal
Posts: 93
Joined: December 1st, 2018, 6:58 pm

Re: Scenario 4: Bay of Pearls

Post by mal_shubertal »

(1) What difficulty level and Wesnoth version have you played the scenario on?
1.16.2 Hard
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10) [1]
5. Easy to win in general, harder to accomplish all objectives (trident, both enemy leaders) and do it quickly enough for a big gold carryover.
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
very
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Straightforward. Same pattern of "help a community of a unit type, get loyal units of that type, become able to recruit that unit type"
(5) What were your major challenges in completing the scenario?
Fighting bats with mostly melee mermen, managing mermen hp with few villages and no healers, neither over-recruiting or under-recruiting.
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
10. Cool dynamic of simultaneous water and land battles that can interact in various ways.
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Seems fine as is. the only-melee mermen at first against a bunch of bats is frustrating, but I think it forces you to think creatively with them.
Attachments
HttT-The Bay of Pearls replay 20220404-180844.gz
(39.52 KiB) Downloaded 83 times
lujo86
Posts: 41
Joined: January 31st, 2023, 9:50 am

Re: Scenario 4: Bay of Pearls

Post by lujo86 »

(1) What difficulty level and Wesnoth version have you played the scenario on?

1.16.2
Highest

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)

1

It's strange, because I don't remember it being this easy, but this is because I foggily remember playing it a bunch when I was younger and way less experienced with BfW, so I must've been trying to keep every unit alive.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?

10.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?

As usual for this campaign, it could use improvement.

(5) What were your major challenges in completing the scenario?

Nothing, since I approached it with a clear goal in mind. I was going to keep the three ranged mermen (disciple, hunter, warrior w trident) alive, and treat all the other ones as fodder. I also had the same in mind for the ground forces - I knew what I was going to keep alive and feed XP for future scenarios, and just recruited a bunch of expendable elven warriors to screen and tank. The map is very easy to beat when you approach it like that.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)

6. Would be higher but you kinda get an army handed to you.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?

It's fine, I guess.
User avatar
ElvishMystical0
Posts: 33
Joined: September 19th, 2018, 12:15 am

Re: Scenario 4: Bay of Pearls

Post by ElvishMystical0 »

1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
Versions 1.12 to 1.16 mainly Easy and Medium. My feedback here is based on version 1.16 Medium.
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
This would be a 5-6.
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Very clear, liberate the Merfolk, defeat the leaders.
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Very clear. You witness the first time the shady side of Delfador. But this is where we start to see a significant flaw in the storyline. Konrad is a young man supposedly leading a developing Elvish army to help him claim the throne, yet he seems very naive and gullible and far too easily led by others. Can you actually be a leader if you're constantly following the advice of others and don't have any kind of desire for power or some consuming emotion as passion or anger yourself? At times he comes across as a village idiot, yet has been raised by wiser Elves.

Would it not be time for an overhaul of Konrad's character? Maybe he could be brash and impulsive, or headstrong, and have Delfador as the wise old man who keeps him in line and makes him think things through. This would give plenty of scope through Delfador of giving advice to newer players who are starting out on this campaign.

It's not like you cannot come up with interesting dialogue. Take for example the dialogue between Bugg and Dwaba-Kukai, the island based Orcish enemy.
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Nothing other than the standard freeing Mermen and sea battles and then the land based battle with Orcs and trying to get experience for units on the flat. Oh and Vampire Bats. I don't like Vampire Bats with their increased mobility, universal defenses and drain ability. Vampire Bats were the major issue in this scenario.

I managed to free all the Mermen quite easily, sending three Mermen (Gwimli, Kaba and Jarla) out to the northern cage. At which point the Naga Fighter Inalai and the Naga Warrior Xnamas both went for Kaba, which kind of messed up his health. Meanwhile further south Gwaba freed the last southern cage while the sea Orc's forces ruined Nepba's day.

Heldaga as always was the only Merman quick enough to get the Storm Trident. Kaba died an honourable death at sea as did the loyal intelligent Nepba who didn't stand that much a chance faced by Bugg and three Vampire Bats. Having only 4HP Nepba killed Bugg and died needing 4XP to level. So close, but those damned Vampire Bats.

The only issue on land were the Orcish Warriors which moved so closely together if I had a White Mage I would have offered them a free wedding. Immediately behind them were a couple of Troll Whelps which made levelling Elvish Archers a bit of a pain.
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
Oh this scenario for me is usually quite a lot of fun, so 7-8. I entered the Bay of Pearls with Cival, the Elvish Captain from the first scenario The Elves Besieged which was my only levelled recall.

This for me is the first scenario in the campaign where you can get your different units working together and have enough enemies to gather experience and level up a few units. But to get experience and level up units, this being Wesnoth, you have to take risks. Some don't work out. But sometimes they do. Highlight of the scenario was Tini a loyal Merman on 6HP on the northernmost village on the island who was attacked by a dying Naga Fighter and also Dwaba-Kukai coming out of his keep. Tini killed the Naga Fighter and Dwaba-Kukai missed both swings. same thing over again in the leader kill with Oceania, on 8HP, in comes Heldaga with the Storm Trident, then Apalala, Oceania survives both Naga and Orcish leader and lands the killing blow to Dwaba-Kukai.

It's stuff like this which makes it all enjoyable and fun. In the end I killed both leaders and, not liking zombie hordes all that much with no anti-Undead units I opted for Isle of the Damned.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?

Nothing. I'd keep it as it is.
Orek
Posts: 27
Joined: June 24th, 2020, 1:02 am

Re: Scenario 4: Bay of Pearls

Post by Orek »

Content Feedback wrote: (1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
(1) Challenging (=Champion=Hardest) in 1.14.17 on permadeath
(2) 9 (4th most difficult = 20th easiest)
... [Difficult] 2, 16, 14, 4, 9, 6, 5b, 10, 13, 12, 23, 8, 7, 3, 15, 17, 19c, 22, 1, 20b, 11, 24, 18 [Easy]
(3) Very clear
(4) Clear and interesting enough
(5) Difficulty of the water battle depends on the initial number of Naga Fighters. When 6 Naga Fighters were recruited on turn 1~2, this scenario was even more difficult than notorious scenario 6 and 9. [Number of initial Naga Fighters: (Run 1: 5), (Run 2: 4), (Run 3: 3)]
(6) 8 (6th most fun = 18th most boring)
... [Fun] 2, 1, 6, 9, 5b, 4, 16, 15, 23, 3, 12, 14, 10, 24, 13, 8, 7, 19c, 20b, 11, 17, 22, 18 [Boring]
(7) As a player who embraces challenges and accepts the beauty of randomness, I'm reluctant to suggest something that may make this scenario easier. However, the number of initial Naga Fighters seems to play too much role in determining the difficulty of the water battle. Recruiting costs for Naga Fighter and Vampire Bat are similar (14 gold and 13 gold), but Naga Fighter is much more difficult to deal with. In this context, the blue side's starting gold reduction from 110 in 1.14 to 90 in 1.16 is probably a good change. It may even make sense to limit the maximum number of Naga Fighters on the map to something like 4 so that every player can have a similar experience without relying too much on RNG and restarting the scenario. Alternatively, in order to reflect their strengths more accurately, recruiting costs can be balanced in such a way that Naga Fighter is a bit more expensive than Vampire Bat.

YouTube Link: Run 1 Run 2 Run 3
Walkthrough: HttT walkthrough (hardest, permadeath, v1.14.17) + General campaign guides (Replays for all scenarios can be downloaded from here.)
JL42
Posts: 66
Joined: December 9th, 2023, 11:19 am

Re: Scenario 4: Bay of Pearls

Post by JL42 »

What difficulty levels and game versions have you played the scenario on?
v. 1.16.10
Lord / Challenging
How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
4 to complete the minimal requirement of defeating one enemy leader. Up to around 6 to kill both leaders, rescue all the mermen, get the storm trident, etc. Having a massive amount of gold holdover from the previous map helped a lot here.
How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Very clear.
How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Very clear; moderately interesting. This is a very smooth introduction to another new unit type (mermen) and new terrain uses. The aspect of rescuing the mermen shows Konrad's character, and Delfador indicates that he is gaining confidence in Konrad's abilities by letting him command troops on his own.
What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
The hardest bit is rescuing the last mermen and dealing with the level 2 defenders up there, and taking out the island leader if you chose to do that. The occasional level 2 orc warrior that the land enemy spits at you can also be dangerous, especially if several of them show up at the same time.
How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
6
What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
This map is a significant jump in difficulty over the previous ones, but it conveniently lets you skip the hardest parts if needed. That makes it another really well-polished part of the campaign progression. Can't think of anything that I would change.

The "sea-orc" is ... kind of weird. Wasn't really sure what to make of that part.

I always take the land route for the next scenario, mostly because I get the impression that it provides a lot more gold and XP to prepare for the upcoming difficult Siege of Elensefar. It might be good to add some kind of dialogue at the choice-point here indicating that the sea route is going to be more difficult.

---------------
About the Overall Campaign:

The maps and storyline here are well-made and polished, though not as completely epic as some of the other campaigns. I like that it is lengthy, giving you time to develop your army, and gradually introduces many different terrains and unit types. This seems like a great beginner campaign since it's fairly easy and the early scenarios are framed as a kind of mentoring environment for the young hero. (However, it's a bit strange that some of the basic dialogue tips, like "hey, loyal units don't require upkeep!" are just now arriving, after I've already played through several previous campaigns without that advice.) There are some glitches that can come up in the Scepter of Fire scenario, and some of the princess-related dialogue around scenarios 17–21 felt a bit confusing and unbelievable (more specific comments in the relevant threads). This campaign is very close to full marks, but due to those few lingering issues and the lack of any real epic blow-you-away maps I'm going to rate it 4 out of 5.
Post Reply