Elves of Fear & Night
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Re: Elves of Fear & Night
Already done. See "Walking corpses."A Guy wrote:How about...
UNDEAD ELVES?
Because Undead just own.
"Reading files and creating cache"
Creating cache? Isn't counterfeiting illegal...
Creating cache? Isn't counterfeiting illegal...
Re: Elves of Fear & Night
And Skeletons and Skeleton Archers and... after all, "undead" aren't necessarily undead humans, they're also undead elves, orcs, dwarves, goblins, etc...
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Re: Elves of Fear & Night
But Skeletons don't have pointy ears...
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Have a look at the Era of Strife, featuring Eltireans, Eventide, Minotaurs, Saurians and Triththa
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Re: Elves of Fear & Night
No bones in ears = skeletons don't have ears at all. Probably the reason you can't tell some of them are elves and some human
Re: Elves of Fear & Night
Thanatos wrote:True... but even talking only ...
I think those creative resources could be used better.
I really would like to see more new and fresh factions. Til now, Wesnoth is (like most other fantasy) reproducing the standards mostly - no offense, this is really done very well and I like the game a lot and appreciate the work of all contributors. Personally I loved to see that Undead are playable, that was one reason to stick with the game (I am a bit biased in that direction ). But: For examplye I really like the Windsong faction for being something really new to me. More original factions like that would make Wesnoth even better than it is. Only Elves-clones are boring, imho. If one has an idea that is really making a great new faction, why just applying this idea only to an already existing faction and not going further to create it from scratch? (I know that especially the artwork is a problem - but the Windsong prove that it can be done.)
As they say - true originality is done. It has been done before. You can only try to do it with a twist..or present it in a different way.
In general, I'm against mixing every single myth, country, era and idea into one big pot - aliens with psi-suckers, with magic elves with egyptian sphyinx and oriental warriors and medieval warriors and stuff..
You end up with a terrible pile of...nastiness..like D&D.
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Re: Elves of Fear & Night
The best way to get something "new" is to take an existing myth and reinterpret it. See J.R.R. Tolkien
Re: Elves of Fear & Night
That too. I really don't see any reason to add any more factions to the world of Wesnoth.TrashMan wrote:As they say - true originality is done. It has been done before. You can only try to do it with a twist..or present it in a different way.
In general, I'm against mixing every single myth, country, era and idea into one big pot - aliens with psi-suckers, with magic elves with egyptian sphyinx and oriental warriors and medieval warriors and stuff..
You end up with a terrible pile of...nastiness..like D&D.
For I am Turin Turambar - Master of Doom, by doom mastered. On permanent Wesbreak. Will not respond to private messages. Sorry!
And I hate stupid people.
The World of Orbivm
And I hate stupid people.
The World of Orbivm
Re: Elves of Fear & Night
For the first part: Maybe. Maybe not. I won't exclude that there is still some originality left out there. (Btw: Where did the Windsong come from? Are they based on something, I do not know?)TrashMan wrote:As they say - true originality is done. It has been done before. You can only try to do it with a twist..or present it in a different way.
In general, I'm against mixing every single myth, country, era and idea into one big pot - aliens with psi-suckers, with magic elves with egyptian sphyinx and oriental warriors and medieval warriors and stuff.
As for the second: I agree in not mixing up stuff too much. But well, what is the basic orientation of Wesnoth (mainline) then? Is there a rule to which setting we have to stick (in mainline)? European mythology, perhaps? And if so: Are all (mainline) factions, races and monsters compatible to this demand? And why should we be allowed to exclude factions based on other mythologies or fantasy settings, even in seperate eras? If I would be some asian or meso-american guy, I would surely be engaged in creating some stuff I could indentify with better.
In general I would agree. However, I surely will not want to discourage anyone who will maybe come up with some great new idea. Even if we would agree that the game (and the world of Wesnoth) is quiet polished, we should stay open enough for additions, where they fit.turin wrote:That too. I really don't see any reason to add any more factions to the world of Wesnoth.
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"The gods can demand nothing of me. Even gods answer to me, eventually. [...] I cannot be bidden, I cannot be forced. I will do only that which I know to be right." (Death in Pratchett's "Mort")
Re: Elves of Fear & Night
"Where they fit" being the key phrase. And the truth is - they won't, most likely. It's really hard to take a new race and mesh it into the history without something seeming off - unless they are integrated so as to make an appearance throughout the entire history, everything will seem just a bit off - why don't they show up ____ doing ____, or ____ doing ____?
For I am Turin Turambar - Master of Doom, by doom mastered. On permanent Wesbreak. Will not respond to private messages. Sorry!
And I hate stupid people.
The World of Orbivm
And I hate stupid people.
The World of Orbivm
Re: Elves of Fear & Night
wouldnt undead elves be kind of oxymoronic?
the different vartiations of "elves" isnt so bad. everyone loves em. and since they as someone said "adapt physically" instead of "with tools" theres more visual variety and so we enjoy playing them more.
but some creative names would be nice.... wouldnt even have to be any sort of derivitive of the word elf... it seems rather stupid to point out that a wise, tall, nature loving, pointy eared, being is in fact, an elf. no?
the different vartiations of "elves" isnt so bad. everyone loves em. and since they as someone said "adapt physically" instead of "with tools" theres more visual variety and so we enjoy playing them more.
but some creative names would be nice.... wouldnt even have to be any sort of derivitive of the word elf... it seems rather stupid to point out that a wise, tall, nature loving, pointy eared, being is in fact, an elf. no?
Re: Elves of Fear & Night
Yep. Because that could also describe Vulcans, couldn't it?Gambit wrote:...it seems rather stupid to point out that a wise, tall, nature loving, pointy eared, being is in fact, an elf. no?
Hmm, new chapters in Wesnoth's history could unfold new discoveries. Right now, as I can see, all the action is quiet limited to a very small part of the world. There is plenty of space for new races and factions. Take a look at our real life history for example and explore the relations between Europe and India or China during medieval times for example. Even though they were seperated by then huge distances, they existed in the same world and had some few encounters even in these times. So I won't be too pessimistic about this.turin wrote:"Where they fit" being the key phrase. And the truth is - they won't, most likely. It's really hard to take a new race and mesh it into the history without something seeming off - unless they are integrated so as to make an appearance throughout the entire history, everything will seem just a bit off - why don't they show up ____ doing ____, or ____ doing ____?
Still, I am all against just adding some more derivates of elves.
ThanatoNoth | Necromanteion | Undead Rights Protection Society
"The gods can demand nothing of me. Even gods answer to me, eventually. [...] I cannot be bidden, I cannot be forced. I will do only that which I know to be right." (Death in Pratchett's "Mort")
"The gods can demand nothing of me. Even gods answer to me, eventually. [...] I cannot be bidden, I cannot be forced. I will do only that which I know to be right." (Death in Pratchett's "Mort")
Re: Elves of Fear & Night
vulcans are "Space Elves"
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Re: Elves of Fear & Night
I thought they were what the US government mounts in their planes.
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Re: Elves of Fear & Night
Here I thought they WERE planes...
There's nothing wrong per se with a new faction based off an existing species. In fact, it's vastly preferable, in my eyes, to create a new faction than YET another sentient species which somehow had been completely ignored by everyone up until that point.
But TRY to be imaginative about it. Most versions of the elves I've seen have been nothing more than recolours of whatever elf sprites were current at the time (even the mainline Quenoth of UtBS were originially this way. it's only very recently that they've come into some sprites of their own). They've not even bothered to thing of new names for the units. If you want a good example of how to make new factions WELL, look to the Extended Era, partiularly the Steppe Orcs, Sidhe and Dark Elves. These factions take old species (albeit not in the world of Wesnoth, but meh) and completely reinvent them. Whole new unit lines, with entirely new cultures, sprites backgrounds etc etc etc. It's not a short process. It's not an easy process. It happens far too often with the elves, and not nearly often enough with other species. But do it right, and it will be a very rewarding process which results in high quality work.
There's nothing wrong per se with a new faction based off an existing species. In fact, it's vastly preferable, in my eyes, to create a new faction than YET another sentient species which somehow had been completely ignored by everyone up until that point.
But TRY to be imaginative about it. Most versions of the elves I've seen have been nothing more than recolours of whatever elf sprites were current at the time (even the mainline Quenoth of UtBS were originially this way. it's only very recently that they've come into some sprites of their own). They've not even bothered to thing of new names for the units. If you want a good example of how to make new factions WELL, look to the Extended Era, partiularly the Steppe Orcs, Sidhe and Dark Elves. These factions take old species (albeit not in the world of Wesnoth, but meh) and completely reinvent them. Whole new unit lines, with entirely new cultures, sprites backgrounds etc etc etc. It's not a short process. It's not an easy process. It happens far too often with the elves, and not nearly often enough with other species. But do it right, and it will be a very rewarding process which results in high quality work.
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Re: Elves of Fear & Night
Oh, wait--Are we talking about the pistol now?
In general, I agree with what thespaceinvader just said--But I do feel like it is on some level "okay" to create an entire new set of races, so long as you make the assumption that they have no contact whatsoever with the mainline races, given that they exist in a different imaginary world.
The problem being that no one can look at the era and say, "Oh, I know what those are!"--You need to document everything really, really well, or the player will feel lost and eventually conclude that you had no plan and put no thought into where these creatures came from
Of course, you also need to build the new set of races from scratch.
And no, this isn't an attempt to justify my current era project--The Faehen Era is the result of my thinking this, not the other way around
In general, I agree with what thespaceinvader just said--But I do feel like it is on some level "okay" to create an entire new set of races, so long as you make the assumption that they have no contact whatsoever with the mainline races, given that they exist in a different imaginary world.
The problem being that no one can look at the era and say, "Oh, I know what those are!"--You need to document everything really, really well, or the player will feel lost and eventually conclude that you had no plan and put no thought into where these creatures came from
Of course, you also need to build the new set of races from scratch.
And no, this isn't an attempt to justify my current era project--The Faehen Era is the result of my thinking this, not the other way around