The "How to play..." Series

Share and discuss strategies for playing the game, and get help and tips from other players.

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JW
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Post by JW »

Big Bird wrote:hey, are you working on a loyalist one yet cause that is the one i really want! please do that one as soon as you can so i can learn some tips on how to use them to their full potential
JW wrote: This is currently a work in progress, so some of the pages and matchups aren't written out yet, but will come with time. I appreciate your patience.
It will be done, but probably not in the next 3 days, just to give the roughest of estimates.

If a section isn't up yet that you want to read you can always browse the other sections to see how your opponent may play against you and try to learn from that. It will be indirect advice but it may help.


Disto wrote:
jonathantan86 wrote:Hmm...perhaps all the AI developers could use the hints JW supplies here in their AIs?
AI developers?
It's my understanding that writing AI is probably the hardest part of any game. If you don't believe me ask Darth Fool. I heard he's been working on the AI for a year or so now. (Is that right?)
Disto
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Post by Disto »

JW wrote:
Disto wrote: AI developers?
It's my understanding that writing AI is probably the hardest part of any game. If you don't believe me ask Darth Fool. I heard he's been working on the AI for a year or so now. (Is that right?)
Darth Fool is only a developer, his AI isn't made for the mainline in particular so he has space to do what he wants (I believe) and also it's more of a project for him, rather then a must do.
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Post by Yogibear »

JW wrote: It's my understanding that writing AI is probably the hardest part of any game.
That's right, improving AI code is probably the most difficult task we face at the moment.

In fact, the AI is pretty good already in skirmishes. That is if you have a front line with 3v3 units, it is good at finding the best way to attack (melee against archers, wounded units prioritized and such).

But it is not good at all at strategy. It does not plan for a couple of turns. It even has difficulties to judge terrain or to take the opponents counter attack into consideration. It could be better with recruiting, too. That is the really hard part to code. And the reason why a good player still beats the AI even if it has twice as much gold.

Overall it is very difficult to put strategy in rules that the AI can understand.
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Oreb
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Post by Oreb »

Very nice tactics here, You know your stuff. Now this will keep the complaints away of... I can't beat undead with Drakes and so on...

I see you don't know what to do for Rebels, maybe I could offer help. By the way I really like what you did with Knalgans
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JW
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Post by JW »

Oreb wrote:I see you don't know what to do for Rebels,
It will come, my dear lad. :wink:
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JW
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Post by JW »

Update: Undead portion finished.

Finished portions: Knalgans, Undead.
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Zhukov
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Post by Zhukov »

This still going? Or has it died in the arse?
(Busting to know how to beat up rebels with northies :twisted:)
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Thrawn
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Post by Thrawn »

Zhukov wrote:This still going? Or has it died in the arse?
(Busting to know how to beat up rebels with northies :twisted:)
unit spamming + luck...
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JW
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Post by JW »

Zhukov wrote:This still going? Or has it died in the arse?
(Busting to know how to beat up rebels with northies :twisted:)
Yeah, I've put this on hold from strategic burnout. I'll be back on it soon hopefully.
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Post by PrinceRepulsive »

JW wrote:
Zhukov wrote:This still going? Or has it died in the arse?
(Busting to know how to beat up rebels with northies :twisted:)
Yeah, I've put this on hold from strategic burnout. I'll be back on it soon hopefully.
Hey! I don't mean to nag, but is two months enough for your strategic burnout to start burning-IN? Cause I want to know more about loyalists.
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Post by Flametrooper »

Thrawn wrote:
Zhukov wrote:This still going? Or has it died in the arse?
(Busting to know how to beat up rebels with northies :twisted:)
unit spamming + luck...
trolls+archers+assasins are your best bet. The Grunt here has no range, neither does the troll but at least he regens. Archer support is an absolute nessecity. Poison with assasins, and don't let Shamen level up. Nagas beat Mermen in meele but not range, though they are better on land. Spam spears if you're desperate. Attack their archers, mages and shamans with trolls(nagas from water work too), fighters and scouts with archers, and the Wose is the one unit you want to use the Grunt with.
Just a few tips I've picked up from various people, vomited up in a hopefully useful manner.
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JW
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Post by JW »

PrinceRepulsive wrote:Hey! I don't mean to nag, but is two months enough for your strategic burnout to start burning-IN? Cause I want to know more about loyalists.
I've been pretty intensely focused on the Era Of Myths (EOM) lately. Unfortunately I've been burning my Wesnoth-self out on that lately.

And yes, I'm pretty streaky, I know. :(
Frostfire
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Post by Frostfire »

good job overall, just hoping you get a rebels section out soon :P
Yogi Bear wrote: But it is not good at all at strategy. It does not plan for a couple of turns. It even has difficulties to judge terrain or to take the opponents counter attack into consideration. It could be better with recruiting, too.
kind of like how instead of making a wraith it made a shadow against knalgans >.>
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appleide
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Post by appleide »

JW wrote:
Big Bird wrote:hey, are you working on a loyalist one yet cause that is the one i really want! please do that one as soon as you can so i can learn some tips on how to use them to their full potential
JW wrote: This is currently a work in progress, so some of the pages and matchups aren't written out yet, but will come with time. I appreciate your patience.
It will be done, but probably not in the next 3 days, just to give the roughest of estimates.
Nor in the next 3*two months.
You link people from your sig to here, just to let them find out you havent finished what they are looking for.... 8)
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Lone_Isle
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Post by Lone_Isle »

I find that with drakes, if you try to fight the enemy on their own terms, you will quickly face defeat: every other faction in wesnoth can attain a def % of 60% or better in defensive terrain, while drakes only go up to 40%.

However, on grasslands, suddenly most units of other factions drop down to 40%, a loss of 20% defense, or 30% in the case of dwarves. Drakes drop down from 40 to 30%, a loss of only 10%.

The key then, is to try not to position your drakes next to defensive cover, and to force the enemy into the clearing if at all possible.

Even the most powerful drake damage dealers: the burner and the clasher, falter and lose out in terms of the ratio of damage they take and deal against say an elvish archer in forest.

Whenever possible, attack units with least defensive cover, and position your attackers so that in order to be attacked the enemy has to position on grasslands/low def cover.

Also the "rogue" type of units present a special case: footpads, thieves, fencers and assassins. The answer to these guys is pretty simple: Drake fighters. The drake fighter is the most efficient unit out of the drake arsenal in dealing with rogue units during day. Augurs are usable during night but are fragile.
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