Why I do not play Drakes and do not like them

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Big Bad Joe
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Post by Big Bad Joe »

'average defense' is nonsesne. It would have to be weighted based on the importance of terrains on a given map in order to be useful.
Yeah, but if we do not have any "given map", it is the best way how to show that they are not that [censored] in defense values..
Anyway - they have at least same defenses as any faction out of their preferred terrain - and with their undisputable mobility - they can always choose a fight..
Remake DRAKES!!
Just bored..
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turin
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Post by turin »

Monkey wrote:
Burnsaber wrote: IIRC, Chaotic & Lawful in wesnoth had nothing to with being morally good & bad, Chaotic units are just fight better at night & vice versa.
Drakes attack villages at night.
That's dragons. Drakes are completely different. I think... ^_^

>_>

<_<

(If you agree this makes no sense, you may wish to join the underground drake resistance: UDR. ;P)
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Elvish_Pillager
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Post by Elvish_Pillager »

Big Bad Joe wrote:Remake DRAKES!!
Yeah, look at the Drake lineup:

Generic, powerful, archer.
Generic, powerful, fighter.
Generic, powerful, mixed fighter.
Generic, cheap, scout.

Not one of them has any interesting abilities. Drakes are the only faction with no abilities. (yeah, yeah, so they can get leadership...) All of them fit the same mold: Tough flier with no abilities.

That totally needs to be changed if Drakes are to be a reasonable faction.

To start with, let's make them interesting, like this:

Alignment now: neutral. proposed: Lawful
Burner line's ranged attacks now: 8-3, 12-3, 15-3. proposed: 4-6, 5-7, 6-8.
Flare's ability now: Leadership. proposed: Illuminates.
Clasher's attacks now: 6-4 & 5-4. proposed: 8-3 & 4-4 backstab.

Now that they're interesting, we can smack them with a little conservative rebalancing:
Burner line HP now: 45, 57, 74. proposed: 42, 54, 71.
Clasher cost now: 19. proposed: 21.
Glider cost now: 15. proposed: 16.
It's all fun and games until someone loses a lawsuit. Oh, and by the way, sending me private messages won't work. :/ If you must contact me, there's an e-mail address listed on the website in my profile.
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Dragonking
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Post by Dragonking »

So many noumber of attack will be bad - they would be able to easy finish all weak units with low hp, eaven on terrian with 70% defence.
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Elvish_Pillager
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Post by Elvish_Pillager »

Dragonking wrote:So many noumber of attack will be bad - they would be able to easy finish all weak units with low hp, eaven on terrian with 70% defence.
It's not inherently bad for a unit to be useful in different situations than similar units!
It's all fun and games until someone loses a lawsuit. Oh, and by the way, sending me private messages won't work. :/ If you must contact me, there's an e-mail address listed on the website in my profile.
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Post by Big Bad Joe »

Burner line's ranged attacks now: 8-3, 12-3, 15-3. proposed: 4-6, 5-7, 6-8.
So your suggestion is just make Burner even more powerful in attacking and take him 3hp?? Ridiculous.. really ridiculous..
And backstab for Clasher with price of 2 gp more??
Just bored..
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Elvish_Pillager
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Post by Elvish_Pillager »

Big Bad Joe wrote:So your suggestion is just make Burner even more powerful in attacking
No... the attack's total and average damage remains the same...
Big Bad Joe wrote:And backstab for Clasher with price of 2 gp more??
You'll notice I also reduced the Clasher's sword damage...
It's all fun and games until someone loses a lawsuit. Oh, and by the way, sending me private messages won't work. :/ If you must contact me, there's an e-mail address listed on the website in my profile.
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Dragonking
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Post by Dragonking »

I'm against idea of giving burners many attacks, cause I agree with Big Bad Joe that this will give them more power - like I said - no weak unit will be able to be alive near them
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Post by Burnsaber »

Dragonking wrote:I'm against idea of giving burners many attacks, cause I agree with Big Bad Joe that this will give them more power - like I said - no weak unit will be able to be alive near them
No weak unit will be alive next to any unit with even at least 50% HP!

I`m all for EP`s suggestions. Make drakes intresting!
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Elvish_Pillager
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Post by Elvish_Pillager »

Dragonking wrote:I'm against idea of giving burners many attacks, cause I agree with Big Bad Joe that this will give them more power - like I said - no weak unit will be able to be alive near them
I have both evidence and experience to back my opinion that more attacks with less damage are less useful.
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Dragonking
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Post by Dragonking »

MP game - elvish archer in forest. One hp left. One XP point need to lvl. And you think he have more chances with burner with 6 or 3 attacks? It's not rare situation on MP that unit near advance has less than 5 hp, and he need only few (1,2,3) points of exp to lvlup. I have too experience and believe me, that drakes will be not only overpowered, but too will be known as killers of weak
Big Bad Joe
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Post by Big Bad Joe »

No weak unit will be alive next to any unit with even at least 50% HP
Wow, what an idea :shock: . I do not want to be extraordinatily personal to you , but have you ever played Wesnoth?? What does the chance to hit have with a HP of attacker? ? ???
Just bored..
Big Bad Joe
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Post by Big Bad Joe »

For EP: Your ideas seem to overpower Drake faction more than it is right now. I have seen you two times playing with Drakes on the server yeasterday, but hope that does not mean that you are trying to make them your favorite..
And.. I really hope that Drakes at least will be as they are now - even overpowered and dumb user race ( seems there is no chance to remake them), not as your outstanding proposal - that means in my view
a) Burners are killing machines, because they deal some damage everytime..
b) Clashers are even more powerful then before because 8-4 backstab for lvl.1 is really unbelievable..
If by the ruling of some cruel fate your proposals find developers and they implement it - I will be forced to make Not - Drake era and hope for finding another players with same feeling for the game..
Just bored..
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Elvish_Pillager
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Post by Elvish_Pillager »

Dragonking wrote:MP game - elvish archer in forest. One hp left. One XP point need to lvl. And you think he have more chances with burner with 6 or 3 attacks?
Sure. By the same logic, obviously the Spearman is amazingly better than the Yeti.

What's more, I can give you a counter-example: An Elvish Archer in forest, with 24 HP and 1 XP needed.

A 4-6 attack, in your situation, is 1.343 times as likely to kill the Archer as the 8-3 attack is.

An 8-3 attack, in my situation, is 37 times as likely to kill the Archer as the 4-6 attack is.

Dragonking wrote:will be known as killers of weak
Where 'weak' means 'having 4 HP or less'? If you have a unit with 4 HP or less, It shouldn't be in your front rank! Besides, even a unit with three attacks is pretty good at killing someone with really low HP!
It's all fun and games until someone loses a lawsuit. Oh, and by the way, sending me private messages won't work. :/ If you must contact me, there's an e-mail address listed on the website in my profile.
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Post by Elvish_Pillager »

Big Bad Joe wrote:I have seen you two times playing with Drakes on the server yeasterday, but hope that does not mean that you are trying to make them your favorite..
Know your enemy, they say...
Big Bad Joe wrote:a) Burners are killing machines, because they deal some damage everytime..
You don't kill people by poking them over and over!
Big Bad Joe wrote:b) Clashers are even more powerful then before because 8-4 backstab for lvl.1 is really unbelievable..
And why do you think they're going to be backstabbing?

Of course, you're absolutely right, so the attacks should be reduced to 6-3 and 3-4.
Big Bad Joe wrote:If by the ruling of some cruel fate your proposals find developers and they implement it - I will be forced to make Not - Drake era and hope for finding another players with same feeling for the game..
Interesting tactic.
It's all fun and games until someone loses a lawsuit. Oh, and by the way, sending me private messages won't work. :/ If you must contact me, there's an e-mail address listed on the website in my profile.
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