Test of the Clans

serg3d · Post by **serg3d** » September 5th, 2004, 9:05 am

I have found out about Wesnoth at Slashdot. Thinking that for the newbie the game would be too hard on the medium difficalty I started on the easy.
I was deadly wrong
For first time player game almoste impossible on the easy. Dworven doors! What a sadistic pleasure scenario writer had ! But somehow I limped to the Test of the clan. And here I'm thinking about giving up. With 200 gold, and a really bad choise of the veterans (Look, I already told I'm a newbie) it seems plain impossible even with load/save cheat. Look, you can't expect first time player to know that you need 1k gold for this scenario. It seems scenario designer thought that any first time player safely dropped out long before this scenario. IMO this scenario should be either removed completly or made optional (I vote for removing).

Post by **Boucman** » September 5th, 2004, 9:11 am

well...

in wesnoth you are expected to go back a couple of scenarios when in that sort of situations.

I know it's quite suprising, but that's not considered cheating...

Elvish_Pillager · Post by **Elvish_Pillager** » September 5th, 2004, 9:26 am

You got to Test of the Clans on your first try!?!?!?

My suggestion: Try playing on Hard. (Now you're looking at me like I'm crazy.) Seriously, even if it's suicide, you can learn a lot that way.

Post by **Dave** » September 5th, 2004, 12:32 pm

I agree that 'Test of the Clans' isn't really very much fun at the moment; just frustrating. It's going to be seriously revamped -- or removed -- at some point.

David

Post by **turin** » September 5th, 2004, 3:33 pm

Dave wrote:I agree that 'Test of the Clans' isn't really very much fun at the moment; just frustrating. It's going to be seriously revamped -- or removed -- at some point.

David

hehehe...

I made it, and now even i don't like it. Remove it.

Post by **santi** » September 6th, 2004, 5:30 am

Just to stress what I have already stressed a number of times:
THERE IS NO AND CANNOT **EVER** BE ANY EASIER SCENARIO THAN DWARVEN DOORS:
On first round get Delfador and Kalenz running, recruit 5 horsemen and start running with everybody(Korrad of course) towards the right door.
Use the horsemen to cover your back and flanks against hits. When
they are hit, do NOT retaliate(just keep running). You finish in 9 turns I think, no matter whether it is easy, normal or hard.

Test of the clans would probably be hard with only 200 gold even on easy.
But if you read the various threads, you will find various "assasin" stretegies, for instance Paladins/Lancers/Gryphon Masters that you can use to neak by and kill Bayar. In fact when I played it I took out
the southerneastern commander in 3-4 turns then slowly moved with all my force west: Basically that force protected the faster "assasin" force
with grand knights and Paladins that was moving to kill Bayar.

Elvish_Pillager · Post by **Elvish_Pillager** » September 6th, 2004, 9:35 am

santi wrote:THERE IS NO AND CANNOT **EVER** BE ANY EASIER SCENARIO THAN DWARVEN DOORS:

What? That's a very presumptive thing to say....

Anyway, there is one already, in HttT itself: The Elven Council.

Post by **santi** » September 6th, 2004, 10:02 am

Elven council is not a "playable scenario" in the sense that you do not do anything, not even recruit. Same in TROW the various meetings with
the elves are not playable(this is Shade's terminology).
Ok, maybe you can make a scenario where the strategy I describe
is implementable in even fewer turns, but my point is that people
usually think DD is hard,while in fact it is currently
ridiculously easy, so it's my #1 contender for rebalancing.

Shade · Post by **Shade** » September 6th, 2004, 10:38 am

santi wrote:Elven council is not a "playable scenario" in the sense that you do not do anything, not even recruit. Same in TROW the various meetings with
the elves are not playable(this is Shade's terminology).
Ok, maybe you can make a scenario where the strategy I describe
is implementable in even fewer turns, but my point is that people
usually think DD is hard,while in fact it is currently
ridiculously easy, so it's my #1 contender for rebalancing.

He he, Well, tone down the Orcs and put some hidden big nasty critter(s) on the fast path. Or set an event that will slow the fast path down by a turn or two. Give the Orcs a chance to catch up. But if anybody does that, tone down the Orcs.

Post by **santi** » September 6th, 2004, 10:51 am

"If you make a scenario unwinnable, people will find a way to cheat"
but who wants to win this way? So make it hard but winnable

Animate · Post by **Animate** » September 6th, 2004, 11:28 am

Boucman wrote:well...

in wesnoth you are expected to go back a couple of scenarios when in that sort of situations.

I know it's quite suprising, but that's not considered cheating...

I agree.
Recruit some Gryphon Riders and train'em to Gryphon Masters. They served me in HttT in many scenarios as assassins.
Another tip: look at Griphon recruiting cost: 32. Look at retaining cost of Gryphon Master: 20... You can recruit Gryphon Riders as many as possible as soon as they are recruitable and train'em.
I made with them TotC in first try, with 100 gold on medium.

Post by **turin** » September 6th, 2004, 1:54 pm

Animate wrote:
Boucman wrote:well...

in wesnoth you are expected to go back a couple of scenarios when in that sort of situations.

I know it's quite suprising, but that's not considered cheating...
I agree.
Recruit some Gryphon Riders and train'em to Gryphon Masters. They served me in HttT in many scenarios as assassins.
Another tip: look at Griphon recruiting cost: 32. Look at retaining cost of Gryphon Master: 20... You can recruit Gryphon Riders as many as possible as soon as they are recruitable and train'em.
I made with them TotC in first try, with 100 gold on medium.

um... this doesn't follow. if you don't get a gryphon XP on the level you recruited him, you are wasting gold, because you could have just recruited him the next scenario you needed him and saved yourself 20 gold.

Porcupine · Post by **Porcupine** » October 6th, 2004, 5:41 am

Back to on the subject though, I am a newbe too, and I am stuck on the Test of the Clans too. Been stuck a couple times before too, like on the Seighe of Ensfor, Dwarven Doars, and Septre of fire. I just stop playing for a few hours, let my subconchess chew on the problem for a while and hit it from a new angle.

BTW, any tips on beating Test of the Clans. I don't got much of an army, just a couple champions, an advenger, 3 griffon masters, a Ranger, a marksmen, and a dryiad.

I don't vote for removing it though. I think it is a great challange.

Post by **turin** » October 6th, 2004, 12:20 pm

Porcupine wrote:Back to on the subject though, I am a newbe too, and I am stuck on the Test of the Clans too. Been stuck a couple times before too, like on the Seighe of Ensfor, Dwarven Doars, and Septre of fire. I just stop playing for a few hours, let my subconchess chew on the problem for a while and hit it from a new angle.

BTW, any tips on beating Test of the Clans. I don't got much of an army, just a couple champions, an advenger, 3 griffon masters, a Ranger, a marksmen, and a dryiad.

I don't vote for removing it though. I think it is a great challange.

um... druid, right?

I don't really have many tips at this point; my suggestion is to recruit a LOT of cannon fodder (worthless level 1 units). thieves, because of their cheapness, work nicely. keep them coming, get konrad on hte keep the whole time, and keep the thieves coming... defeat southern enemy... get more thieves... try to get across river without losing any advanced units (losing thieves is fine)... kill enemies.
but keep in mind I don't know if this works, its just what i'm going to try when i playtest it...

Invisible Philosopher · October 6th, 2004, 9:54 pm

Shade wrote:He he, Well, tone down the Orcs and put some hidden big nasty critter(s) on the fast path. Or set an event that will slow the fast path down by a turn or two. Give the Orcs a chance to catch up. But if anybody does that, tone down the Orcs.

Move the Cuttlefish to the fast path, and make sure it actually gets in the way instead of letting you easily run past it.