Request: New unpassable terrain

scott · Post by **scott** » November 9th, 2005, 4:30 pm

I think this is exactly what Jetryl predicted would happen. The gameplay goal is impassable terrain. You can't come up with something then start applying a 101 realism arguments as to why it's passable or what happens to different units when they attempt it. The game needs impassable terrain (IM and many others' O).

The cavewall has steep sides; thus, it meets the sheerness requirement for an outdoor obstacle... it probably continues to prosper as the impassable terrain for this reason. It's actually somewhat believable if you look at it as a cliff.

Tomsik · Post by **Tomsik** » November 9th, 2005, 5:00 pm

I think something like this would be good.

Post by **Neoriceisgood** » November 9th, 2005, 5:01 pm

Why can't we have something like really high mountains with clouds above them where some peaks stick out; Like; mountains so high that they break trough the sky

lpassos · Post by **lpassos** » November 9th, 2005, 5:35 pm

Hmmm.

Just my two cents.

Paint the limit of the map as a normal terrain type. Similar to the ones around it. That would be mountain next to mountain, plains next to plains, swamp next to swamp, whatever.

If the player tries to move the unit out of the map, tell him that place is away from the battle and if he really wants to disband the unit.

I don't find it very realistic to have every map surrounded by huge mountains ou whatever it is. What about maps with ocean tiles? Will they have high mountains too?

Regards,
Luis

scott · Post by **scott** » November 9th, 2005, 6:08 pm

The edges of the map have nothing to do with this discussion. That was an artistic diversion. The issue is with the usage of cavewall tiles on outdoor maps to provide an impassable terrain. The idea was to replace that tile with something that made more sense graphically while keeping the gameplay aspect exactly the same as before.

hands · Post by **hands** » November 9th, 2005, 8:50 pm

The whole can/can't climb/fly over Everest argument really has become pointless and off-topic IMO. At least the forum got past whether or not a wall could work on the first page. Wesnoth may or may not share atmospheric characteristics with Earth. Things such as gravity and geology might also be slightly different on a world where magic exists.

I think the point is to create a more harmonious visual cue to indicate a physical limitation than what previously exists. I think that clouds with one or two very high peeks poking through the clouds would suffice for the most part. Voids and star-filled canyons might do the job, but I'm not sure how visually obvious it is that a flying creature couldn't move over a star-filled canyon (even though it looks very nice). An imposing-looking volcano might also do the job on maps that are meant to be more dark. The updraft from an active volcano can impair flight quite effectively.

I think the possibilities with a volcano are also interesting because a map with a harmless looking mountain in one scenario could be edited for a later scenario after the mountain develops into an active volcano restricting certain movements.

hands · Post by **hands** » November 9th, 2005, 8:58 pm

scott wrote:The edges of the map have nothing to do with this discussion. That was an artistic diversion. The issue is with the usage of cavewall tiles on outdoor maps to provide an impassable terrain. The idea was to replace that tile with something that made more sense graphically while keeping the gameplay aspect exactly the same as before.

I really don't disagree with this for practical purposes, but as far as polish goes, it could be very nice to have some options from the "artistic diversion" comments to use with non-rectangular maps. That being said, I hope that something is created soon for general use with the possibility of working on artistic map edges later on.

savagust · Post by **savagust** » November 19th, 2005, 4:16 am

Darth Fool wrote:How about active volcanoes. Obviously the lava would be deadly to ground units, but the toxic fumes could be deadly to flying ones as well...

I agree with your idea.

Or may be a tornado in some specific situations(events)
(Just a suggestion...)

Garm · Post by **Garm** » November 19th, 2005, 6:17 am

swamps with toxic in, corrosiv acid

Tomsik · Post by **Tomsik** » November 19th, 2005, 8:29 am

I'm not sure, maybe this idea was proposed:
add some mages war to wesnoth history and make terrain type destroyed by magic so you can't pass it.(random magical effects and such)

Post by **Jetrel** » November 19th, 2005, 11:16 am

Tomsik wrote:I'm not sure, maybe this idea was proposed:
add some mages war to wesnoth history and make terrain type destroyed by magic so you can't pass it.(random magical effects and such)

For the love of god, people...
Avoid explaining things with magic at all costs.

What don't you get about this?

Tomsik · Post by **Tomsik** » November 19th, 2005, 11:56 am

Why not?
Maybe magic is not common in wesnoth now, but maybe sometime in wesnoth history...

Naeddyr · Post by **Naeddyr** » November 19th, 2005, 12:34 pm

Has anyone suggested some sort of political or religious boundaries? As in, if a person crosses the line All Hell Would Break Lose And Dance (for some reason), which is why no one is allowed to cross the border. This shouldn't be too difficult to implement, either - some sort of boundary-transition graphic (border stones and thick red lines, raized forest, tollbooths on roads etc. for flavour), and making tiles beyond the border impassable by codemeans. This doesn't work for everyone and everything (just like the void doesn't fit in some scenarios, and the mountains in others), but it could be used somewhere. And its unapologetically abstract, which might be a good or bad thing.

Garm · Post by **Garm** » November 19th, 2005, 3:11 pm

Naeddyr wrote:Has anyone suggested some sort of political or religious boundaries? As in, if a person crosses the line All Hell Would Break Lose And Dance (for some reason), which is why no one is allowed to cross the border. This shouldn't be too difficult to implement, either - some sort of boundary-transition graphic (border stones and thick red lines, raized forest, tollbooths on roads etc. for flavour), and making tiles beyond the border impassable by codemeans. This doesn't work for everyone and everything (just like the void doesn't fit in some scenarios, and the mountains in others), but it could be used somewhere. And its unapologetically abstract, which might be a good or bad thing.

funny idea, a burial ground(only undead can cross)
a church town( a town where only whitemages(and the uppgraded one) can go trhough

Post by **turin** » November 19th, 2005, 3:26 pm

Tomsik wrote:
Why not?
Maybe magic is not common in wesnoth now, but maybe sometime in wesnoth history...

It has to do with how good it is for fantasy development (which is, very bad), not with whether it can possibly be explained by some verbal gymnastics.