Balance in 1.1: Knalgans have been overnerfed

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Shadowdweller
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Joined: August 4th, 2005, 10:16 am

Balance in 1.1: Knalgans have been overnerfed

Post by Shadowdweller »

Warning: Long-winded and wordy

I fully recognize that the faction was on the overstrong side around 1.0. However, I've been playing through a number of games in 1.1 and I've come to the conclusion that the knalgan faction has been weakened too much. Some of the changes and discussions listed below actually occurred in 1.02 or before, but I feel they are still worthy of note.

Dwarven Fighter: The combination of high damage output, high HPs, and decent defense has traditionally been a potent one. However, when considering balance it should be recognized that while the fighter has excellent defense on mountains, most other fighting units ALSO have good defense on such terrain. In contrast, the dwarven fighter lacks even half-decent defense in forest terrain, which is traditionally average to good for most other basic-fighting units. Moreover, the fighter is slower than most others and lacks a ranged attack. And, most importantly, costs more than the rank-and-file warriors of most other factions. These are all exploitable weaknesses that have been used for many versions.

Recent changes have lowered defense in villages, and increasingly reduced the resistances. This is too much. For 16 gold in what is a defense-themed faction the fighter SHOULD be strong.

Dwarvish Guardsman: Despite seeing relatively frequent use in MP, this is actually (IMO) one of the game's more worthless units. It carries an exhorbitant price of 19g, has FEWER hit points than the fighter, currently has the exact same base resistances as the fighter, does pitiful damage, and actually also has worse defenses than the fighter (in hills, mountains; same mediocre defense in villages).

These weaknesses all being exchanged for a measly reduction of 1 point of damage of every five from physical means, or 1 of 10 from magical...but ONLY while defending. Advancements only make the weaknesses worse as the Stalwart falls further and further behind in terms of hit points (only 45 at level 3!)

Dwarvish Thunderer: Combination of good defense, good HPs, good resistances, and a good melee attack for an range-focused unit. I do not dispute the recent HP reduction greatly as this has tradtionally had far more than most other archer-units (Exception: Drake burners). But it should be recognized as having had a weakening effect on the Knalgans as a whole. The thunderer-line has also suffered the defense reduction in villages that the Fighter and Guardsmen have.

On outlaw units: These have been mostly untouched. They are relatively inexpensive and make good support units. However, due to low hit points and poor resistances they make bad rank-and-file warriors. Many of them still cost the same amounts as basic warrior-types of other factions.

The faction STILL lacks means of conveniently dealing with high-defense units. Unlike the Northerners, which is the only other faction lacking magical attacks, the main Knalgan fighter units are pricy, slow, and thus do not make good swarmers.

I feel the across-the-board defense reduction while stationed in villages is thematically inappropriate. Dwarves in most fantasy settings are hardy and strong defenders. Even if the faction previously WAS overpowered and in need of nerfing, this is not the manner I feel it should be nerfed. Alternatives might include reducing griffon damage.

[/rant] Anyways, just my thoughts.
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Elvish_Pillager
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Post by Elvish_Pillager »

*checks files*
*checks memory*

This isn't a nerf - this is a reversion of a previous, and IMO ill-founded, decision to buff the Dwarves' defences in villages. After the change, they were just too darn tough, so their defence was lowered again.

Due to their relatively high HP and resistances, they still do rather well in villages.

I agree, though, with your point about the guardsman. The ability Steadfast changed many versions ago, and AFAIK there has been no serious rebalancing of the unit (or at least of its upgrades) since then.

I personally think that the ability should be changed again. At the very least, remove the 50% cap! it doesn't do anything with the current Guardsman, and it cripples the ability's use in potential new units.
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Shadowdweller
Posts: 53
Joined: August 4th, 2005, 10:16 am

Re: Balance in 1.1: Knalgans have been overnerfed

Post by Shadowdweller »

Shadowdweller wrote: Dwarvish Guardsman: Despite seeing relatively frequent use in MP, this is actually (IMO) one of the game's more worthless units. It carries an exhorbitant price of 19g, has FEWER hit points than the fighter,
Correction: Since they've automatically got the resilient trait, they actually have 3 MORE HP than a base, unaltered fighter. Still not worth it.
Soliton
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Post by Soliton »

relevant balancing changes from 1.1+svn:

* increased Dwarvish Guardsman HP from 35 to 42
* increased Dwarvish Guardsman ranged attack from 4-1 to 5-1
* increased Dwarvish Stalwart HP from 39 to 48
* increased Dwarvish Sentinel HP from 45 to 56
* increased Dwarvish Sentinel resistances to blade and pierce from 20% to 30%
* decreased the village defense from 60% to 50% for the Stalwart and Sentinel
* increased the forrest and sand defense from 30% to 40% for the Stalwart and Sentinel

I'm not sure when that village defense reduction you refer to occured but it must have been ages ago, which makes me not understand you there as you acknowledge that dwarves have been "on the overstrong side around 1.0".

Guardsman don't get the resilient trait by default. Btw they also get 2 traits again since version 1.1.
"If gameplay requires it, they can be made to live on Venus." -- scott
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