Anyone Creative Enough
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Anyone Creative Enough
I was wondering if someone had the time to code a small graphics program that could be used to create units made just for wesnoth.
Anyone got any ideas.. im not that great at it, but if was added it would make campains easier to make
Anyone got any ideas.. im not that great at it, but if was added it would make campains easier to make
I think it would be a program where you fill in:
NAME OF UNIT:
HP:
XP:
and all the other stats, + the path of the unit's graphic
NAME OF UNIT:
HP:
XP:
and all the other stats, + the path of the unit's graphic
"There are two kind of campaign strategies : the good and the bad ones. The good ones almost always fail because of unforeseen consequences that make the bad ones succeed." -- Napoleon
I have tried...and I used Gimp but the program has a huge learning curve with it.
I was thinking of
Units Graphics= With 100x100 open area to work with
1. Pencil Paint
2. Resize
3. Fill
4. And other odd and in things.
And with a text program where you just fill in the blanks for attack/hp/exp and etc.....
It would have a list of all the unit properties, you would just need to put numbers in blanks..
I was thinking of
Units Graphics= With 100x100 open area to work with
1. Pencil Paint
2. Resize
3. Fill
4. And other odd and in things.
And with a text program where you just fill in the blanks for attack/hp/exp and etc.....
It would have a list of all the unit properties, you would just need to put numbers in blanks..
The thing is that lack of a graphics program is NOT the problem with making new units. Lack of art talent can be a problem, but good, free pixel editors abound.
Lack of a unit stat creator is NOT a problem when making new units. It's almost trivially easy to edit an existing file with a text editor.
What IS difficult is the hoops one has to go through to get everything put together. You have to know where to save the art files. You have to know where to save the unit config. You have to know how to find AND modify multiplayer.cfg or any scenario.cfg (if it's a level 1 unit) or understand the concept of programming the unit advancement tree and/or recruit list. When someone asks 'How do I add my unit to the game' I cringe because the answer is so complicated.
It would be nice to have a single drop folder that accepts both art and unit config files and automatically plugs them into default somehow (maybe a text file in that folder that has a list of unit ids and eras/factions).
Maybe there can be a separate unit management GUI that lists eras/factions and campaign scenarios, and it allows you to drag custom units over to the desired areas (specific factions, entire campaigns, certain scenarios, etc.) and reprograms the cfg files for you.
Neither is a great solution - it's just that the inherent flexibility in the game engine means hoops will be jumped through.
One day someone may come up with an easy-to-code solution for inserting your spiffy units everywhere you want to use them.
Lack of a unit stat creator is NOT a problem when making new units. It's almost trivially easy to edit an existing file with a text editor.
What IS difficult is the hoops one has to go through to get everything put together. You have to know where to save the art files. You have to know where to save the unit config. You have to know how to find AND modify multiplayer.cfg or any scenario.cfg (if it's a level 1 unit) or understand the concept of programming the unit advancement tree and/or recruit list. When someone asks 'How do I add my unit to the game' I cringe because the answer is so complicated.
It would be nice to have a single drop folder that accepts both art and unit config files and automatically plugs them into default somehow (maybe a text file in that folder that has a list of unit ids and eras/factions).
Maybe there can be a separate unit management GUI that lists eras/factions and campaign scenarios, and it allows you to drag custom units over to the desired areas (specific factions, entire campaigns, certain scenarios, etc.) and reprograms the cfg files for you.
Neither is a great solution - it's just that the inherent flexibility in the game engine means hoops will be jumped through.
One day someone may come up with an easy-to-code solution for inserting your spiffy units everywhere you want to use them.
Hope springs eternal.
Wesnoth acronym guide.
Wesnoth acronym guide.
If this tool is to be made, i think an idea is to parse all the current units into the program or at least the posibility of this, so one can quickly browse the different units, add new, delete and so on. I dont think it should include an image editor, but it could include a feature for automatic copy a unit image into the game dirs when you add a new unit.
Also, an editor to the movetypes can be added later.
Also, an editor to the movetypes can be added later.
I believe the greatest hurdle to take in creating new units is to make them fit in the game, both concept-wise and regarding play balance. It takes a good deal of knowledge of the existing units and game tactics involving them to come up with new units that don't spoil what's already there and have a good niche of their own.
The best way I see a tool like darune describes help in this process is to provide an interface for assigning stats to a unit image/concept and then compare them with what's already there, such as:
"melee damage: 18% above the mean for all lvl 1 units, 25% above the mean for lvl 1 MP units"
"closest units for comparison: 1. fencer (hp per cost, damage per cost, defenses...) and 2."
Whatever, I'm sure there are genii (plural of genius
) here that can provide some good unit stat comparison criteria.
The best way I see a tool like darune describes help in this process is to provide an interface for assigning stats to a unit image/concept and then compare them with what's already there, such as:
"melee damage: 18% above the mean for all lvl 1 units, 25% above the mean for lvl 1 MP units"
"closest units for comparison: 1. fencer (hp per cost, damage per cost, defenses...) and 2."
Whatever, I'm sure there are genii (plural of genius
) here that can provide some good unit stat comparison criteria.Try some Multiplayer Scenarios / Campaigns
No, balancing is easy, it takes a little while, but it requires no skill at all. Drawing good units, either from scratch or not takes hours, and requires a very large amount of skill.Rhuvaen wrote:I believe the greatest hurdle to take in creating new units is to make them fit in the game, both concept-wise and regarding play balance. It takes a good deal of knowledge of the existing units and game tactics involving them to come up with new units that don't spoil what's already there and have a good niche of their own.
The best way I see a tool like darune describes help in this process is to provide an interface for assigning stats to a unit image/concept and then compare them with what's already there, such as:
"melee damage: 18% above the mean for all lvl 1 units, 25% above the mean for lvl 1 MP units"
"closest units for comparison: 1. fencer (hp per cost, damage per cost, defenses...) and 2."
Whatever, I'm sure there are genii (plural of genius
That's the whole point, a tool cannot replace the designer's skill, it can only speed up the process. So I don't really see a tool that makes creating the art easyAttila wrote:No, balancing is easy, it takes a little while, but it requires no skill at all. Drawing good units, either from scratch or not takes hours, and requires a very large amount of skill.
.Try some Multiplayer Scenarios / Campaigns
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Elvish_Pillager
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It's definitely false. An incompetent balancer will not succeed.Attila wrote:[balancing] requires no skill at all.
It's all fun and games until someone loses a lawsuit. Oh, and by the way, sending me private messages won't work. :/ If you must contact me, there's an e-mail address listed on the website in my profile.
Balancing is always hard and takes alot of time. Some statistics tool might help making more balanced unit, or it could come up with a suggested price. However it is virtually impossible to come up with an absolute formula since how valuable a unit is, is dependent on the metagame, thats also one reason its hard to do balancing. However i think it should be possible to come up with a fairly good estimate in the case of wesnoth. If anyone will try to come up with a formula for price calculation it would be cool. One note, the level(in itself) of the unit should actually count against the price unless the unit happens to have leadership, because a higher level unit will give the enemy more xp.
Regardless, the issue is not how to make a good unit, it's how to make any unit.
People make crazy units: monks, dwarvish magicians, evil elves, etc. They're just having fun, whether or not they labor under the illusion of their units ever being included in the game (and thus require any kind of balancing). It's hard to have fun when it's a pain in the rear.
People make crazy units: monks, dwarvish magicians, evil elves, etc. They're just having fun, whether or not they labor under the illusion of their units ever being included in the game (and thus require any kind of balancing). It's hard to have fun when it's a pain in the rear.
Hope springs eternal.
Wesnoth acronym guide.
Wesnoth acronym guide.