Raid Ability

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CuddleFish
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Raid Ability

Post by CuddleFish »

Currently in wesnoth, if a unit attacks, it's turn ends, even if it still has remaining movement points..

I'm proposing this ability called "Raid", it is basically a more powerful version of skirmisher, in addition to being able to ignore ZOC, the unit's turn does not end after it attacks..

this ability is very useful when you're fighting in narrow passageways, and its useful for picking off specific units like mages

One possible application is to give this ability to goblin wolf riders, vampire bats, elvish scouts, and drake gliders... these units die very quickly in any kind of combat, and they're not cheap either... :(
in comparison footpads, gryffons, and loyalist calvalry are much tougher :twisted:
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Post by Dragon Master »

I kinda slightly like this idea. But it also sounds ridiculous. Put it on WC's :twisted:
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turin
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Post by turin »

So, sort of like an optional berserk? Or does attacking use up some MPs, just not all of the remaining ones? There is already a proposal similar to the second one, called Parthian shot; it works basically like this. The unit has 10 MP. It can attack, no matter how many MPs left, as long as it has not yet attacked this turn. If, when it attacks, it has 8 or more MPs left, it still has 1 MP when the combat ends. So it can retreat to your support line, but it can't attack again, and it can't leave the battle entirely.
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CuddleFish
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Post by CuddleFish »

Dragon Master wrote:I kinda slightly like this idea. But it also sounds ridiculous. Put it on WC's :twisted:
Unit Description
"Walking Corpses are the bodies of the dead, re-animated by dark magic and trained in guerilla warfare. Although weak in combat, these zombies crawl away to safety after they attack"
Last edited by CuddleFish on August 30th, 2006, 1:34 am, edited 1 time in total.
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CuddleFish
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Post by CuddleFish »

turin wrote:So, sort of like an optional berserk? Or does attacking use up some MPs, just not all of the remaining ones? There is already a proposal similar to the second one, called Parthian shot; it works basically like this. The unit has 10 MP. It can attack, no matter how many MPs left, as long as it has not yet attacked this turn. If, when it attacks, it has 8 or more MPs left, it still has 1 MP when the combat ends. So it can retreat to your support line, but it can't attack again, and it can't leave the battle entirely.
a unit can only attack once per turn, or else there's too much room for abuse (imagine a wolf doing a drive-by on 3 dark adepts)
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Maeglin Dubh
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Post by Maeglin Dubh »

I do believe that was Dragon Master's attempt at humour, but your enthusiasm is commendable.

EDIT: I refer, of course, to your WC Unit Description.
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CuddleFish
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Post by CuddleFish »

Maeglin Dubh wrote:I do believe that was Dragon Master's attempt at humour, but your enthusiasm is commendable.

EDIT: I refer, of course, to your WC Unit Description.
lol I intended it to be a joke
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Ken_Oh
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Post by Ken_Oh »

This is the "Retreat" ability in JW's "Abilities that have potential" thread.

I coded and included it as "Dash" in my Abilities Era.
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Maeglin Dubh
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Post by Maeglin Dubh »

Abilities era? I must see this....
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scott
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Post by scott »

CuddleFish wrote: a unit can only attack once per turn, or else there's too much room for abuse (imagine a wolf doing a drive-by on 3 dark adepts)
Imagine 3 wolves doing 3 drive-bys on 1 dark adept who has 1 open hex.
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CuddleFish
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Post by CuddleFish »

scott wrote:
CuddleFish wrote: a unit can only attack once per turn, or else there's too much room for abuse (imagine a wolf doing a drive-by on 3 dark adepts)
Imagine 3 wolves doing 3 drive-bys on 1 dark adept who has 1 open hex.
hmm... 3 wolves when playing against undead..
dont we have better ways to spend our money?
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Ken_Oh
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Post by Ken_Oh »

Maeglin Dubh wrote:Abilities era? I must see this....
http://www.wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=11999
http://www.wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=12000

I meant to put it on the campaign server, but I got too busy with getting ready to go to China. Now that I'm here, I have to get a house, net connection and a computer before I can really do anything. But, please, if anyone wants to use anything I coded (or, for some cases, others coded), go ahead.
jaywalker
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Post by jaywalker »

I like this idea alot, and talking about "full retreat" after a combat is unlikely if the attack(one with raid ability) is conducted from 5 hexes away, and that's if we are putting this ability on a scout unit.

Also I am thinking with raid , not only a unit has right to use its MP after a combat(unless its trapped withing enemy ZOC), but when it is trapped within enemy ZOC, should it's MP be available again after the trapping enemy unit is killed.

The unit with raid ability can only attack once at a turn, just like a regular unit(in contract of berserker units).

Problem I can already think of, though, is that putting this ability on a scout unit on a big map... this could totally change the value of the scout unit(especially flying ones) :twisted:

I think this could be espeically interesting if it's a racial, that is, faction based.
Dragon Master wrote:I kinda slightly like this idea. But it also sounds ridiculous. Put it on WC's :twisted:
well then don't put it on WC's :P
who am i, you sure you want to know? i am another noob who thinks he play wesnoth long enough to modify the game
Makrond
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Post by Makrond »

CuddleFish wrote:a unit can only attack once per turn, or else there's too much room for abuse (imagine a wolf doing a drive-by on 3 dark adepts)
A unit can only attack once, even if (through use of :debug and :unit moves=1,2,3 etc) it has movement points.

It's funny though, because I was mulling this one over last night and I thought it would be good if maybe one or two reasonably low-powered units had it. It would not only greatly improve their lifespan, but would make leveling up a lot easier (which raises a balance issue, but if you made Raid have another effect, XP+50%, then there wouldn't be too much of a problem).

The Drakes, methinks, would seriously benefit from an ability like this - most of them just don't have the resistances to counter the lack of favourable terrain.

The idea would need a lot of tweaking, from a balance perspective (and I'm not even looking that hard!), but if it was a faction centered around the Raid ability, focused on balancing the obvious tactical advantage it affords, it might just work.

Hehe... I like that description of the Walking Corpses.
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SaintDust
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Post by SaintDust »

This is a great idea and would be perfect for the game.

Once you move you can not attack and then move again. All mp left over from attack is dumbed.

If you attack with max move points at the start all move points then could be used but the attack phase of the unit is over.

This is the basic idea i see with this Dash, Raid, Retreat idea.

But when i think of retreat i picture a unit who can only attack first then move. Just the opposite of how it works now.
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